How'd It Happen Podcast

EA Csolkovits, Why Givers Earn 3x More than Takers? (#189)

Pubished on September 8, 2021

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To learn why givers earn 3x more than takers, we have to take a journey in the story of EA Csolkovits. His beginnings were humble, growing up as the son of a milkman and working as a janitor from 16 years of age. When he still was at the beginning of his janitorial career, EA started cleaning an expensive house in Chicago. That was a good improvement for his work, but little did he know that cleaning that house would have been the beginning of something greater. The house owner was, in fact, June Martino, known as the “McDonald’s den mother”.

The Importance of Having a Mentor

EA was surprised by the kindness of June Martino, and one day he took the courage to ask her about McDonald’s story, way before they made a movie about it (The Founder). Next thing you know, June talked to EA for the whole day, and he understood that he needed his own Ray Kroc. He needed a mentor.

A couple of months had passed, when he received a late-night call from a janitorial service company, asking him to show some rugs to someone. He was tired and didn’t want to do it, but after being promised a free Saturday, he decided to go. And once again, fate put him at the right spot, as that someone was Sam Robbins, a millionaire businessman from Detroit. Sam became EA Csolkovits’ mentor and taught him everything about success, with the promise that EA would teach the same principles to others in the future. He is now doing so with Givers University, where he helps transform your personal, business, social, & family life, into a life of increased & exceptional happiness, freedom & greatness.

And now here’s EA Csolkovits.

Full transcript below

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Podcast with EA Csolkovits. Why Givers Earn 3x More than Takers?

SUMMARY KEYWORDS

people, discern, givers, takers, business, ray kroc, teach, life, thought, mike, mentor, janitor, June Martino, called, hear, reference, realize, person, listeners, point, McDonalds, takers, Sam Robbins, Happy first, love, diamonds, yes, wisdom, wealth, wellness, defeatism, disruption, destruction, failure, temporary defeat

SPEAKERS

Mike Malatesta, EA Csolkovits

Mike Malatesta 00:51

Hi EA, welcome to the show.

EA Csolkovits 00:59

Thank you so much, Mike, for having me on your great podcast and what could be a better name for a podcast and how did happen, I just, when I first saw that that I’m gonna love this guy, this is just great because he just says hi that happened, it’s a great question.

Mike Malatesta 01:13

Well, thank you for that. Thank you. i rAnd I’m so glad that you reached out to me I think you contacted me on pod match, which is a platform for podcasters and people who want to be on podcasts and I joined up with that, maybe a month or so ago, maybe a little bit longer. And you were, I haven’t had a ton of people reach out to me but the people that I’ve had, I’ve been so impressed with, like this, you know, so he reaches out to me and I’m looking at, I’m like, Oh, why don’t you send me something about, and he sends me something about him and you will learn as we go through today that this guy is. Well, he’s something else. He is a very very accomplished human being, and we’re going to explore that story today. So anyway, thank you for reaching out to me. Um, before I go any further I should ask you, which I never do this but I’m going to ask you a question before I ask you the question that okay with you. As long as I give an answer before I get my answer. Okay. I’ll leave that in your hands. So the question is, what, what is EA stand for.

EA Csolkovits 02:19

It’s actually my first. Okay, so it just makes it real simple you know because, you know, last name being sold commits and when people see it, you know, because there’s a sciatic and throws them for a loop to begin with and they stare at I’ve even had people try to correct me and say my own last name, they say no you don’t say, Oh is that right I know how to say it, but so EA just became an easy simple way, and it’s a little bit different too, so it became a sort of monitor if you will, as people reference it so I’m 1,000% good with it and certainly known that way.

Mike Malatesta 02:51

Okay, I’ve always been fascinated by people who go by, initials, it’s sometimes it’s a family thing, sometimes it’s a, you know, shortcut thing or abbreviation thing because you have a difficult name or whatever and sometimes it’s something you get in high school when you know you’re on a team or something they just start calling you something and then that just sticks with you the rest of the rest of your life.

EA Csolkovits 03:13

And I’m glad to be da because until I was 12 years old I thought my name was go chop wood.

Mike Malatesta 03:22

Okay. All right, so let’s, so let’s get this thing started. Yes. I asked everyone the same question. To get started, it’s a simple one. How did it happen for you.

EA Csolkovits 03:36

I have to say it’s a story leading to story leading to story, and, and I can share with you from the very beginning and really, you know, the, the interesting events that I really had in my life that really blessed me in so many ways and sometimes when they didn’t seem they were blessing me as I look in retrospect, they were huge blessings. My, I was born in Chicago. And my father was a milkman. And back when I was five years old I’m 65 Now, when I was five years old, my father, you know, had a distributorship for Twin Oaks, dairy, and it was just, you know, one man operation, delivering milk, and I don’t know, Mike I remember as a child, they had these boxes outside the house and it was look man’s box right, and, and the milk went in there and homeowner with a piece of paper scratched what they wanted and, and well you know what was funny, my there was money in the box, all the time and no one ever touched it. Yeah, everyone knew that was milkman money right. And, and, you know, milking in glass gallon jugs back then, you know, and so at five years old on help my father here and there. And then as I got a little bit older, I took my first big step into becoming successful. And Mike, I became a janitor. That was my first big step. Now, I didn’t mind doing that by the way cuz business was always picking up.

Mike Malatesta 04:58

Right, yeah, okay, that’s like a waste business, that’s like a waste business joke I get that I, that’s where I have my career in the waste business so yeah, we got it so janitors waste guys we have the same thing I guy. Yeah, funny, funny things are always picking up. Yes.

EA Csolkovits 05:16

We went to different schools together it couldn’t get better. So, now I’m a janitor, and I will say this, my two real interesting events happened while I was jammed. The first was at the ripe old age of 16 I was able to be bonded, which means insured, and I could go into expensive places including them in case my bumper hit something hurt in there just join an insurance company with a carrier. So I was able to clean the home of a lady, her name was June Martino and I was there every Wednesday cleaning your house. Now, I mean I know who Jude Martino is unless you’ve seen this movie. Did you see that movie with Michael Keaton about McDonald’s called the founder, it was out for some time and it’s a very young streaming it’s and basically it’s the McDonald’s story if you will, and Michael Keaton plays Ray Kroc, okay yeah and and it’s very Hollywood eyes, you know, I was I lived in that area I lived in Oak Brook area, which is where the McDonald’s World Headquarters was so in my lifetime I watched and literally lived that whole phenomenon I was right there. So it was very Hollywood eyes but you know that’s how it is, but it wasn’t. It was based on certain events. So I was in cleaning June’s House and in the movie, by the way for your listeners that may have seen the movie, again, it’s called the founder. When you see Ray microkey Talking Ray Kroc, talking to a lady outside his office all time he says June June June June, that’s the lady whose house I clean, that’s, that was her and that was June Martino,

Mike Malatesta 06:52

so she’s Ray Kroc, assistant or

EA Csolkovits 06:56

her she worked for him. Before Ray was in McDonald’s, he used he was a milkshakes mixer salesman, right, and she worked for him then. And then when Madonna started she just started stayed all the way through. So I was in there every Wednesday and here’s the thing, Mike that was very interesting, as it relates to how to tap. I noticed that June was worth more zeros than I had fingers and toes. At this point when I remember right, and I was, and she was very approachable, very nice. Never condescending to anyone she had maids and butlers and, you know always extra kind of always said hello to me she knew who I was at least you know, there’s a view if you will and we would always, you know, say hello whenever she saw me and very nice. Yeah. And that was the first thing that status meant that I thought rich and successful people are supposed to be jerks. And here’s this lady who was very nice, and approachable, you know, and just always there to help, I mean I was actually surprised that I would kind of, and that astonished me. And of course I love being in our house cleaning and you know, clean out, pull the Rolls Royce out three times and sweep the garage, because here’s a car that’s worth 10 lifetimes of my income, you know, and this is on the screen and send in

08:11

a Rolls Royce, the real thing.

EA Csolkovits 08:14

So, so there was a day when I could tell June was in an extra good mood. So I went up door, and here’s a snack, no 16 year old yours truly mustered up all of his courage, I’m going to go ask June Martino the icon of the area, ever knew doing was, I’m gonna ask her a question. So I went up to her next June, she said yes you’re getting very nice always very nice. And I said, Can I ask you a question she was sure, I said, could you tell me about it she said what. And I said well the whole McDonald’s thing. I’m not kidding, He put her arm around me brought me in the kitchen, and told me the entire story I asked her in the morning, the entire day. She told me the whole story while we sat in the kitchen. She had amazing mother and bringing us food. So she didn’t have to stop telling us the story. The whole McDonald’s history up until the moment we were sitting in her kitchen. So I mean, I think in my case is to Martino

09:07

and

EA Csolkovits 09:08

the dude Martino telling me this whole thing was 16 year old kid, and she thought she referenced the part of the movie, again, if any of your listeners saw the movie. There’s a part in the movie where June goes to Ray dude Martino goes to Ray Kroc, and says, we’re out of money, we don’t have any money we have money going out faster is coming in, there’s nothing in the deal, there’s nothing there. And Ray ends up calling the partners and they have an argument because Ray says I need more vengeance. I need greater percentages. And again, that’s all Hollywood isn’t exactly the way it happened anyway. But the event is true, you told me about a decades earlier. And she said, There was a time when. And so, he didn’t have any money, so he didn’t pay me. He paid me we agree that Worthless. Worthless less than worthless companies time. And he agreed to take the calls from the bill collectors when they done. And I thought, so I just had to ask her, I said, Dude, I gotta ask you this, and I’m a janitor. I live paycheck to paycheck. If I don’t get paid on Friday because I get paid Friday on Friday. If I don’t get paid on Friday, and Joe in Saturday. She said, so I asked her, Why did you do it. And I could tell Mike, this not no 16 year olds I just asked her a question no one else had asked her before, and she sat back, stared at me, but I could tell she left, she was no longer there she was at, no one had asked her why before they always talked about what happened. No one’s on why did they happen. And I didn’t I was just curious. And so when she spoke, it made the hair stand up on the back of my neck. Because the way she said it. When I said June, why don’t you do it. Bite your work for nothing, no money and get worthless stock. And her answer to me Mike was because I believed in rain, and the way she said it, and I remember Mike my very first thought, the first thought that came to my mind was, I’ve got to find me a Ray Kroc, that’s what I need, I need a Ray Kroc, I need someone who could put me under their wing, who can mentor me, teach me because I had the desire but I’m the son of a man Bergdahl janitor who thinks is fun time of the day is getting free songs on the jukebox, while I’m cleaning bowling alleys at two in the morning. I need a Ray Kroc, that said, and it wasn’t two or three months later, we got a phone call at that same janitorial service to big events that happened while I worked there. And I was late at night, you know, I had already punched out and back then my dad the clocks, you know where you punched him out and felt like really punching them out. Yeah, sure. I punched out. Yeah, no fingerprint button on the front and the nail. These are the really old ones and we, you know, made this loud noise. So, they’re good. So I punched out the janitorial service Jerry and the phone rings, and it’s at nighttime, it’s only human either. And he hangs up the phone, he said well, I need someone to carpeting, This guy’s in front,

12:21

he’s open to diamond.

EA Csolkovits 12:22

He wants someone to show him some carpeting for the story he’s leaving in the morning he’s got to see it tonight. And it’s okay, once I got to do me. He said I need you to do it. I said, Jerry, I already punched out. I’m tired. I’ve been cleaning all day. I’m already fine sound gone, there’s nothing, no I and I and I’m top of it. I don’t know anything about carpeting, because well, take one of these wheels and walk this way in this way in the room, measuring wheel, and he said call me on the phone now quarter, and they said no Jerry and I said no, a second time. I said that one’s done. He’s I’ll tell you what you feel, go. He said I have to stay here. He said if you go out you the your your pick off your day off of any Saturday you want. Now for a janitor, that’s a huge negotiation. Because, yes, you know, we’re cleaning while businesses are so Saturday’s, we work all day into the night, because companies are closed. On Saturday off is like, Well, you got to be kidding me. So I repeated it back. And these Saturday I went off, that he said, and he Saturday. And I said I said, Okay, I went back and punched back in, put some carpet samples in the car, setting the stage that might. I’m going be grudgingly physically tired, worked all day, right,

13:49

and

EA Csolkovits 13:50

I’m emotionally spent, I don’t want to do this thing. There is only one reason I’m going, and that’s because of the one Saturday off, I get the day. That’s it. Little do I know I’m getting ready to meet the man that will change the trajectory of my life for ever. So I share with your listeners, be observed and be aware of the events in your life that will happen on the thin edge of a dime that at that moment will seem so insignificant that will change the course of your life, for ever. And I met by Ray Kroc, Sam Robbins, who was my business mentor,

Mike Malatesta 14:40

and how. So you went, That’s so Tell, Tell us how that went. So you got your wheel your, your begrudging you’ve got you’ve begrudgingly said yes, and only said yes because of the carrot of a Saturday off that you’re choosing. And I’m sure you I’m thinking your mindset is probably still like, Ah, you know I have to do this. How long did it take you when you got there to have the revelation that you just described.

EA Csolkovits 15:11

Got a good question, and you nailed exactly how I felt by the way, I mean if you were to put an audible tone it was. Yeah, That was the audible don’t ever be. I’m going to meet this gentleman. When I met him. There was an immediate report and I felt like oh my god I had already met him before. I don’t know if you’ve ever met anyone where you just, you’re immediately so comfortable with and you feel like he just talked about anything. And we did. We talked for a couple of hours. I showed him the carpeting, none of it was going to work because we only had commercial grade and he was opening a diamond store so when at some plus, and we just had commercial carpet so that I mean that was out the door, literally, and we talked and talked about all different kinds of things. And as I was leaving he offers me a job. And I said, What should I do about diamonds, all I know about diamonds is that, number one, they’re really expensive. And number two, some lady is going to ask me for one. That’s all I know about diamonds, he said. He said well I’ll teach you. I’ll teach you and I said no no no. And little did I know at that point, like he was so sweet. He really was a genius in the truest sense of the word, and he hooked me, and he knew he was hooking me but I didn’t because I was so naive. As I was walking out the door he said the following which was gonna grind me and he knew it would, as I’m walking out, saying now that I’m all set I’m a janitor my teachers all say, he said, What do you have to lose, you can always go back being a janitor. He knew that would get me, and I actually said no, and left. And I’m driving home now this is this is late at night now approaching midnight, so it’s late at night so I’m driving home and it’s grinding on his right, you know people they can mess I can always pick it up, I can always clean that can always go back any gender, anywhere, any place you know, nope. All right, I’m gonna go find out what he means. So that turned the car around after being halfway home and went back, and to my surprise, he was still there. Now we’re pushing midnight, literally, because he was going to be leaving the next morning going back to Detroit, right. And I said, Okay, what do you have in mind. And he offered me a job. And, and I could tell, I could just tell because we’d already talked for a couple of hours. I could see my, that this man, genuinely, you could see, I could tell he was rich, it was pouring out of his, you know, out of his pores, and that he was, and I could tell he was very happy I could just sense that he was truly a happy person. And that’s what I want I wanted to be rich and happy, not knowing I had it backwards. We’re supposed to be happy first and then rich, but at 16 years old I wanted to be rich and then I figured I’ll be happy if I’m rich, right, not realizing I had a backwards at that point, which he later on taught me, I had a backwards, so he offered me a job. And for the next four months. I got in the car at four in the morning, Friday night, Saturday morning, four in the morning, drove 301 miles on the road to get the mileage from Chicago to Detroit, had a meeting with him for six hours, got back in my car and drove all the way back home, all in the same day, every single weekend for four months in a row and I never missed a weekend, because I wanted, what he had. And I knew he was my Ray Kroc and I was gonna hang on for dear life. And I made, and I asked him, Sam, will you please teach me, teach me everything. I don’t know i All I know is I want it, but I don’t even know exactly what it is. And could you teach me how to become successful and happy I’m the son of a milkman I just realized I didn’t know what I needed to know and I needed someone to teach me and just show me that I could do it because I figured during my keynote. You’d better believe I coach, he was a regular person who wasn’t a superhero or an alien. So, you know that touched in my mind I had that reference. So I asked him, and he said, Okay, I’ll teach you everything. I won’t hold back anything I’ll teach you all of it with one condition. Now, at that point, Mike, by the way, whatever he said next, I was saying yesterday, didn’t matter what it was. And he said, here’s what I want from you when the time is right, and you will know when that time is I want you to teach as many people as you possibly can. Everything that I teach you. Absolutely. And that at 19 years old, became the vow. The oath, and the commitment I made that later on, manifested as givers University. Okay, well there’s a ton of stuff there, do you mind if we dive in a little bit. No, there’s literally way more than 2000 pounds worth so

20:02

many times they’re gigaton. So he, as you were talking about a trip to Detroit, Michigan, every weekend for four months. Yep. And talking to him and listening to experts put up a little.

Mike Malatesta 20:26

Although it’s not directly the same it reminded me of Napoleon Hill, and Andrew Carnegie so when Napoleon Hill, you end up, ended up writing thinking go grow rich, you know his mission was to go, essentially be a fly on the wall, a very successful people, so that he could then package up what it was that he discovered about these people and be able to share it with the world. And, I mean, he was, he was, he was an adult when he was doing this and he did it for I think, two decades before the book came out, but as I was listening to you talk it reminded me of that kind of a thing, like where you basically gave in to this person, that so impressed you that all you wanted to do was be around that person as much as possible. Not and he took to absorb everything but he was also the wise one who’s like okay I’m giving this all to you yeah you absorb all of it but you don’t you dare, hold on to it yourself right, you got to give this back. Am I nuts with that or you did that,

EA Csolkovits 21:44

no, no, as a matter of fact, one of the things and I don’t want to sound corny to your listeners, but I can share with you the reference that he gave me that has to do with the information, and it started with the word love. He asked me said you don’t love this. And I said, I’m going to meet a woman merrier. And if you will, we’re going to be in love. He goes, I’ll give you the definition. I said, Okay. He said, Love is put in your heart, but not to stay. Love is not love, until you give it away. And he said, all the things I’m going to teach you the wisdom. You have to give it away. Otherwise, if anything,

Mike Malatesta 22:28

I’m writing that down to you. That’s a lot. That’s heavy stuff for for a teenager, to hear from someone a couple of things that, that I that I noted when you’re going through that first of all, with June. How long was it after you had this discussion with her. Do you remember how long before this call came in for you to go and measure for the carpet was in

EA Csolkovits 23:02

about two to three months, it wasn’t really long, okay and it was this, when, when she told me that thing and I immediately said I need to cry. Remember how intensely I felt it was an instantaneous thought, that is the game, my mind was that said, that was like the answer isn’t in

23:23

my mind in my own mind and wired. You know that, you know that that was the, this

EA Csolkovits 23:34

is this and I don’t you know Ray Kroc I didn’t, I need a Ray Kroc, and so that was my first thought, so genuinely was maybe two or three months later, literally out of the blue.

23:45

Sitting there that night. I could have just as easily said. Right. You could have tried. I said,

EA Csolkovits 23:54

trying to talk my way out a little did I know that that’s why I share with your listeners, you know, don’t pass up. You don’t know where to play out and how it’s gonna play out, we teach it certainly, we teach the sermon, something that’s not being taught anywhere today.

Mike Malatesta 24:11

Well that’s another thing I wrote down yes so you reluctantly said yes you tried multiple times to say no to us but then after you said yes and after you met Sam and after his impact resonated with you, you said yes, all the time. Right, so I,

24:31

so I actually want to get your

Mike Malatesta 24:32

message because nowadays, and maybe it’s now now. I hate saying, it makes me sound like I know something that other people don’t know but it seems like people may not be as anxious to say yes to something because they are so what could go wrong with the yes as opposed to what could go right with the Yes. And then you also have people more established people people on podcasts and, for example, famous people saying you know I’m very protective of my time and I only say yes to things that, you know, are below they might say to you No, it’s something that I could say hell yes to I’ll say yes to it if I can I’ll say no and I think I always think to myself and I want to hear what you have to say, I always think to myself i i don’t know i I never know whether saying no is the right thing until I know more about what saying yes could mean to me. But I’m curious what you, how you think and process that whole yes thing.

EA Csolkovits 25:37

Very much so. And first I have to digress for a moment I appreciate when you say nowadays, because I know that when I listened to something on the radio, and I know all the words of the song, and then the host of the show comes and says, Well, We hope you enjoyed our time with the Golden Oldies. And when did I become a golden, man. So one of the things we teach, and it really is right to your answer, right to your answers we talked about givers and takers because it really is the heart of what you, is that the answer to that question is the heart of that we teach something that simply is not being taught anywhere else. It’s just that simple. Today, I know you’re listening, businesses are opening and closing faster than ever before. Products are being antiquated overnight. And we’re moving so fast. All we have left is relationships, and no one’s teaching us how to discern those relationships. So what we do. And I wouldn’t entirely 1,000% agree with the reference of the gentleman you were making about unless I could say, oh yes. I mean, I’m sure, you know, he has his reasons, etc. I wouldn’t necessarily agree with that, for the reasons I’m about to share with your listeners. We first I want to mention in listeners, we love everybody. I say that emphatically We love everything, teach people how to separate the person who we love, from their deeds,

27:18

which we may not love.

EA Csolkovits 27:20

We teach people how to separate that and then what to look for, not broad swaths of inaccurate information that when you hear it you go oh that sounds really good, but what do I do with that. We actually teach people, these are the things to look for the actual deeds. When you see them doing these things. Look for these days. The example I’d give you Mike is right now, you have itchy eyes and a runny nose, I can probably guess you have a cold. I’m not able to see the cold, but I know the cold is the cause, and I can, I can see you have a goal, by virtue of observing the symptoms, we teach people look at these symptoms, and when you see we even give them checklists. Here’s the six arrows that take or shoot at givers all the time. The six arrows of their quiver. Here’s the five do’s the 25 things givers do. Here’s the 25 things takers do, and these will help you discern. Should I bring this person closer in my life. That would mean they’re a giver and givers bring with them the three W’s of wisdom wealth and wellness, we might bring those people in, or should I be risk. Risk, doesn’t matter, because takers bring with them, that’s read these have a taker which is defeatism just struggle. So I think that you stamp out every day. Think about when your stress levels spikes throughout the day. Think about the time you have conversations with people and at the end of the conversation. You barely remember what you talked about, but you do know you have no life they just drained. All of those have one thing in common. There’s a name attached to him. And no one today is teaching us how to discern who should we have in our life. I’m a self improvement guy,

29:22

I guess, how about the other guy, get right, what do we do that. No one’s teaching people, sir. Who should we pull out the gentleman yesterday.

29:39

He said, Yeah, you know, we should have five people you want. The five.

EA Csolkovits 29:46

And he stared at me with this blank look and I said, That’s my point. And no one’s teaching us how to discern what’s the detail, we look for the things that do that help us discern who are the givers and who are the takers in our life. So when someone, and one of the things my business mentor taught me to the point of what that other gentleman said to you, unless you say how against right. He said the following. When you’re a giver, people will take advantage of you expected. But you are never diminished because they did so on them. You are never diminished, he said, they lose. He said they lost the relationship, they lost you. And he said, and here’s the part is he taught me about what’s called the law of compensation. He said the law of competition is constantly striving to be unbalanced. He said, so the fact that you gave to them. Remember, number one, you’re never diminished so you don’t have to be afraid and productive. To your point, to your question. You don’t have to be protective and afraid of that, because that’s going to come back to you from another business, another person, another entity, you will get that back because the law of compensation, not sometimes not 10% 100% of the time we’ll strive for balance. So in that scale. We want to be the investment part. Because here’s the rewards are the investment we want to be loading that up all the time and doing our best to get that scale out of balance, because it’s going to bring itself back into balance with our rewards, all of the time, so I would have loved to have a serious conversation with a gentleman who says, Yes, because I can say I can share you times in my life where I compelled businesses to do business with me because I invested so heavily in them. They almost felt morally obligated to do business with me, right. So there’s a difference between givers and takers.

Mike Malatesta 31:48

So I want to get into that more. But but first I want to, when did you start give us University, or when did it begin.

EA Csolkovits 31:57

Well, in its seed form as an oath, obviously I was 19 years old with the oath and bow I mentioned, yeah, and 91 is when we first started, actually that was when the first name came out of givers University, and said you know we need to we know what’s going to be a mechanism that someday. As I began to compile all this and my, you know three temporary defeats in life each one caused me to write a book, so I’ve never been in that position again. And those became by the way, the sifting of that also I had a radio talk show when I was. I interviewed three millionaires, every hour, for five nights a week for two years solid so I interviewed over 1000 millionaires in two years on a radio talk show I had back in 91. And so the information I gleaned from them and from my business mentor then compiled into this series of three courses which is the cornerstone of givers University called give to be great. And then that cause this all that so 91 was really about the time where the name happened. And that began the slow arduous process through decades. I finally getting this point because one of the things my commitment and my vow to my mentor Mike was. He said, you’ll know when the time is right, and there’s never been a better time to teach discernment than today, because it’s not being taught anywhere no one’s being taught, how do I discern who I should pull in close, and who I should be respectfully distancing in my life, so that my productivity can go up instead of down.

Mike Malatesta 33:34

Okay. Okay, so, so, That’s 30 years 1991 We’re recording this in 2021. So that leaves a period of time, for you personally between 19 ish, and 35, give or take, you’ve got this oath that Sam planted in the seed for which Sam planted in your head at age 19 Take us through 19 to 35 What did. What did you do, and then what was that thing that occurred that made you take the more formal action and and start givers University.

EA Csolkovits 34:17

Okay, great. It’s a great detailed question. The first thing, and it has to do with basically with what I call my three temporary defeats, and as my business mentor says, I’ve never used the word failure. He said failure sounds eternal, it’s got an eternal feel to it, he said don’t even use the word eliminated from your vocabulary use temporary defeat, and here’s why every adversity, this is right in Napoleon Hill, every adversity carries with it the seed of an equal or greater benefit, not some, not a few of them, all of them. He said, and when we beat when our wisdom grows we begin to realize, and then we start to welcome and embrace temporary defeat. Because we realize what’s happening. He said when you get tackled. When you stand up, you’ll realize you’ve got to first down, you’re still in the game, you weren’t doing an obligation, so don’t throw yourself out the gate, that’s what people do. So through the course of this after with the, the, the diamond business, we were very very prosperous with that. And then I decided that I wanted to do some training and started a training company with a separate gentleman, while I was still being my business mentor, and I started a training company, and as I was in my early 20s At this point, and when the company was doing great. We were out of Berkeley Illinois, and it was very very successful we have multiple offices training other companies

Mike Malatesta 35:38

and how to grow, who was the, who was the person you started that business with,

EA Csolkovits 35:42

his name was Jim, Jim Duncan. Thank you. And yeah, and so Gemini started that business, and he had 50% 950 percent.

35:53

And

EA Csolkovits 35:54

it led to my first major temporary defeat and caused me to write the first major book complete, of course, so I wouldn’t ever be there again. They got to be mentored at the same time. So it was a trend of companies we’re training different businesses, and, and when I speak reference someone I usually don’t like the last names to sort of really goes business, you know, because I’m not necessarily speaking positive when someone. So, but also i’ll just reference him as Jim.

Mike Malatesta 36:20

Okay, other stories so if i. So if I asked you that again, just tell me it’s none of my business. Yeah sure, of course. Yeah, for sure.

EA Csolkovits 36:29

So, so Jim and I had, we had very successful business multiple offices doing great. Now back in. Back in the day that nowadays. Oh boy, okay yeah back in the day there was a machine that sat on the desk, you remember this might, and it was called a voice, answering machine. One side had a cassette tape that you recorded your outgoing message and people called you. And on the other side was a cassette tape and these were cassette tapes about this big for those that may see this visual. It’s actually the real McCoy cassette tapes, and the right side was that will keep recording. She was voice actuated. As long as someone talked, it would keep recording. So, I left home for about an hour and a half. I came back from home as I’ve gotten our hands, and the whole paid the 60 Minute tape was used up. This this is crazy as some kids got a hold of it because that had happened before, when they realized it would keep recording they would play in right so that some kids, so I’m rewinding. Why was I in for a shocker. So, as I play back the magic.

37:34

My partner

37:37

was the man.

37:39

It was like

37:42

back then.

EA Csolkovits 37:45

Again there was a tone in the background and let you know someone’s calling in the Call Waiting. Yeah exactly, call waiting and call conferencing. So what he did inadvertently was, I could hear in the background while he was leading the message on my recorder I could hear his receiver so fast he put my machine on call recording with him and someone else and I was leaving home and recorded the whole conversation.

38:12

I wasn’t even home.

38:14

So here’s the thing,

38:17

the phone call,

EA Csolkovits 38:19

contain the step by step plan. They had to take over the company and kick me out of it, even though I was at 50% over. It was extraordinary. I couldn’t believe what I just heard. And let me tell you, Mike. When you hear it in someone’s own voice, it’s way different than third party. I’m hearing it in his own words. And this is just, you know, This is not, there’s nothing deniable here misconstrued. And, and I think back, now what are the odds of that first of all, Jim could have called me when I was home I would pick up the phone, no he called me when I was gone. When he called me. That other guy didn’t have to call right then. No, he called right then. And they, by the way when they talk, they could have talked about golf. No, it was that exact conversation going over the plan step by step, which is was almost exactly a 60 minute conversation. Oh my gosh. Mind blowing. Yeah, boggling. I thought I just can’t believe this. I just I listened to it again I just, I was so blindsided. Because I didn’t know what to look for. I didn’t know what to discern. I hadn’t been, I was reading it but I hadn’t been taught it. So as a result of this I thought now what am I gonna do well, I’ve got to reach into my training that my business mentor is training me and one of the things he trained me on Mike was never allow your emotions to really, select when you do, you’re reacting and you don’t want to be there, be responsive, and you’re responsive when your intellect is controlling your emotions. I remember the example he gave me said, you know, in the medical community if you’re getting a treatment. If they say he’s reacting to it. That’s not good. Right, he’s not doing good on the treatment. If he’s responding to the treatment. He’s doing good he’s doing better. I said, you always want to be in responsive mode not reaction mode, so always make sure your intellect is controlling your emotions, and you will be in responsive mode. Now let me tell you, this was not an easy task. At this point, I was in an emotional upheaval, to say the least and I was grappling. For my training on how do I get my mind around this and control it so

Mike Malatesta 40:34

yeah it was this completely out of the blue when you heard this, this, this thought had never been broached or every color on top of blue. I mean it was a true literal 100% blindside just a punch in the guts,

EA Csolkovits 40:49

nowhere, out of nowhere. And then, you know, in the actual words that’s what you know I mean it was a what there was in the scuttlebutt it wasn’t a rumor, you might not plan step by step, which is what was so mind blown. So, sleepless night. And I reached into my training. He said okay so the next day I told him, I said, Jim, you need to buy me out, said we have seven days to do this we need an agreement and we can make it now. I said, I’m doing something else for my business mentor which I had intended on wanting to do anyway. And I said we seven days. So we did reach an agreement, and I got a couple of monthly payments from him and I thought every one of them was a gift because I already knew what kind of person he was. I didn’t even expect the payments right. But here’s what’s interesting about that. Because I reached into my training, because I had a mentor, which I recommend for every one of your listeners have a mentor and listen to them but make sure they’re the right person and you’ve discerned up front because I listened to my mentor and my training, I saw Jim. About a year later, at an amusement park and it was fired up. I mean I knew who he was, he was my partner I know what it looked like right, he didn’t see me. He just didn’t see me because of where we were standing, but I knew it was him. There was no question, and I had already heard in 12 months, he’d found for personal bankruptcy. Business Bankruptcy, he’d gotten divorced, and as I’m looking in, it looked like he had aged 20 years. And that same 12 months, Mike, my income was 100% over the previous problems with him. And that caused me to write what’s called the givers mindset. That’s the first course of givers University, and that is how a giver thinks differently than a taker, they’re wired differently they think differently, And, and when we say the word giver, by the way we’re not labeling a person we’re labeling the deeds of that person, remember I said we separate that saying with a taker when we say paper we’re not labeling the D, that person is a baker. So, this. So, the mindset, how does a giver thing. So, in that course, I can give it to some of your listeners a couple arrows just as a quick reference to some good nuggets because I’d like to share some good information medium information. And then a couple days later, we’re gonna get into 25 dues, it’s a two page checklist of the actual dues, these are the deeds to look for print it off, put it in your pocket walk around with it, because when they look around and they go, inevitably when they see it, they go oh that’s so nice to be taught, no one’s teaching us how to discern who we should close

43:34

actually distance because they will impact our life as a direct result. Well yeah, let’s

Mike Malatesta 43:40

share it let’s share some of those but first I want to ask you how did you know which ones were the right one. How did you How did you know this you’ve used this word discern many many times and I understand what discern means. But, you know, putting a definition, or sort of a concrete definition around an observation is sometimes tricky.

EA Csolkovits 44:05

Exactly right. So, hence the example I gave you of the cold in the symptom. We use the way to discern, not the sermon as a definition, but the way to discern through the deeds, the symptoms, look at the actual deeds, the person is doing right. As example two of the six arrows, and, and we’re going to give these we want your listener they have them free. We’re givers University, that’s what we do, we’re gonna give it what we want to give away quality things to people to help them. So, there are six primary heroes that takers love the shoot of givers, and most people don’t even realize they’re getting hit, they’re walking around bleeding all day they don’t realize because no one’s taught them. This is a skill set to observe. Using the example. It’s like when you’re getting ready to buy a green car, all of a sudden you realize how many green cars are on the street, right, the green cars were always there. We were just our, our attention and awareness wasn’t focused on the green cars now it is. So we put people’s attention and focus on something that’s already present, and show them how to discern the color green, right, how to look at those symptoms and look for these, and out of the 25 dues, when you see someone at 13 of those dues on one side or the other you can start to discern okay they’re being a little bit dangerous. Yeah, I need to I need to be thinking about maybe respectfully dismissal, because their deeds are showing. And as we say the following your talk talks and your walk talks but your walk talks louder than your talk talks. Okay, I got it. I need to speak louder than ever. Heroes to give things that do. Most which you will see them in conversations, high ground, not emotional conversation into a highly emotional low ground personal attacks. You’ll see them switch the conversation into, and by clear references such as you don’t know what you’re talking about. Remember, you don’t know what you’re talking about. You don’t know about the subject, you don’t know which type you don’t know me, right. So, one of the things a taker can do and you will watch them do it their deeds, they will switch gears and when they do you can know right then they just got revealed, they will switch gears from a fact based, high moral ground

46:44

into a

EA Csolkovits 46:46

Rolodex, because they have nothing they can base it on. So a taker will go into personal attack mode giver won’t do that. They will stay on point. Right, another arrow that we will see is a taker will attempt to feebly transfer their guilt. Their take your guilt onto the giver. By saying things like, you made me angry. You made me do it. And interestingly enough, Mike, that statement isn’t even accurate. You can’t make someone else angry, they can allow you to make them angry, we have the choice to accept that or not. Oh, automatically just allow people to make them angry. They fly off the handle because their emotions are really in their impact. And they’re reacting instead of responding. So the statement itself first of all is not accurate to begin with. When you say you made me do it. But when you see them transfer guilt by reference of deeds, or the deed itself is a reference, you,

47:48

you may.

47:52

It’s also what do you think,

47:56

when they start to discern,

EA Csolkovits 47:59

now they’re getting a skill set that puts them ahead above everyone else, because so many people are to say give them like no reference general terms, but no one says how do we discern that, how do we, what should we be looking for. I became a commercial pilot to fly my own planes in years past, and one of the first things my students, my instructor when I was becoming a private pilot said, look out the window the aircraft. And when you see a plane go from this size to this size real fast and get concerned. That’s a bad sign. Yes, because it’s coming at you, and the closure rate may be 600 miles an hour, you need to do something by set what you want to see is a plane. And then as time goes on it gets like that smaller Yes. Here’s what we teach, we teach people how to look at the plane when it’s at a distance and see. Is it coming at me, and should I be respectfully distancing myself before it becomes a problem so you don’t have to bail it out and stomping out fires all the time, take care of it before it happens to good discernment,

Mike Malatesta 49:11

okay so you got my attention that I want to explore this a little bit more, because there are, there are a lot of, in my experience, people that I wish to be takers are often very good at either one being takers. When you know when the answering machine is not on. In other words, not in front of you. Yeah. Um, so they present where you’re like, awesome. And then it’s. Here’s how it. I mean, I’m sure. Do you agree with the mean there’s, there’s people who are very good at being that kind of taker, I guess, and I’m wondering how you, how the discernment process works to get to that, because it feels like it’s easier if someone does like what you said where they say you made me feel you You did this, you did that you did that it’s clear, that’s great, but but like, like, like, Jim. If you hadn’t intercepted that message. If you hadn’t discerned that Jim was that type of person.

EA Csolkovits 50:29

Yeah, for sure. Great question. And we’ve actually statistically proven that 20% of the population are givers. That means you put 20% of the population in any situation doesn’t matter what it is they’re going to in a short period of time begin giving contributing investing and helping. They’re going to always be the first one to step forward, they’re wired that way, that’s what they do. By contrast, the other Grand Canyon extreme 20% are also takers. These are people who in a period of time will begin to craft a way to begin to take spiritually and financially, emotionally, the list goes on and on 2020 That’s 40 What about the other 60% left. Those 60% are what we call fencers to your point, right, they sit on the fence, they act like givers when they’re with givers and they act like takers when they’re wood takers. It’s really great relationship, but you need to manage those relationships, and you need to keep an eye on them because you don’t know what side of the fence, they are and they switch right so what we want to do is through discernment we learn to look for those people, and discern that the

51:40

closeness them.

EA Csolkovits 51:47

So let’s say my someone they care about because the things we teach him to sermon are used in the family. They used in socially across the board. Let’s say they had one of your listeners had some what they love, they really care about them, but they can tell locally that they perish. What do you do, you know,