In 2002, Harry Massey founded Exponential Health Innovations, a research and design company in the field of bioenergetics, the study of detecting and correcting energy in living systems. Within this group, Harry serves as chairman of NES Health where he’s invented clinical technologies for practitioners, and CEO of Energy 4 Life where he’s designed wearable technology to restore people’s energy for life. These endeavors grew out of his own research into health as he sought to overcome bedridden chronic fatigue syndrome in his youth.
Harry also wrote and directed The Living Matrix: The New Science of Healing (www.thelivingmatrixmovie.com), Choice Point: Align Your Purpose, and Supercharged
(www.superchargedmovie.com) to educate and inspire the general public about bioenergetic approaches to health and well-being.
You won’t want to miss this fascinating episode!
To learn more about Harry Massey, please visit the links below:
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Video on How to Harvest Energy 4 Life – Harry Massey
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Podcast with Harry Massey. How to Harvest Energy 4 Life.
energy, body, people, harry, called, coffee enemas, system, life, energetics, pulse, climbing, glandular fever, practitioner, years, day, talking, extreme, liver, fever, field
Harry Massey, Mike Malatesta
Mike Malatesta 00:06
Hey everybody. Welcome back to the show. And today I am fulfilling my promise to you with another amazing success story. I’ve got Harry Massey on the podcast. Harry, welcome to the show. Welcome.
Harry Massey 00:22
Yeah. Thank you. It’s great to be here.
Mike Malatesta 00:26
Yeah. Oh, oh, a little shout out to Justin Breen for connecting us. He’s connected me with a lot of great people over the years. And Harry’s just the latest of those to come on the show. Harry, how did you and Justin meet?
Harry Massey 00:43
You know, we met sort of on another podcast, so I was on a Mike Koenig podcast. And then Mike just texted us both and said we should get to know each other.
Mike Malatesta 00:54
Okay, okay. I listened to his podcast most I don’t remember. Hearing your episode. Has it? Has it dropped yet?
Harry Massey 01:02
It dropped. I think in last March. Yeah.
Mike Malatesta 01:07
Okay. Okay, so maybe I’ve forgotten it by now. But Mike’s podcast is called Capability Amplifier, I think is the name of that podcast. But anyway, okay. So that’s the connection. So, let me tell you a little bit more about Harry and, and then we’ll get started. So Harry’s story is incredibly inspirational for anyone dealing with a long-term severe illness, or overcoming other kinds of seriously challenging circumstances. And who among us doesn’t have someone in our life at least, whether it’s official or not, that’s dealing with something like that. It’s, unfortunately a very common thing to experience. So just briefly, Harry was sick with serious chronic fatigue syndrome all through his 20s. Four of those years, he was bedridden, six years completely housebound. Being the extremely determined person that he is, he tried many different things on his recovery journey, including nutrition. Naturo-pathic, is that how you say that? Yep, naturopathic. Okay. I, I knew I was going to trip up on that. So fasting, Gerson Therapy, which my understanding is like a plant-based diet, maybe,
Harry Massey 02:25
Gerson Therapy is pretty horrendous, I’d say. It’s basically you do these coffee enemas, like four or five times a day, and then you drink tons of vegetable juices. And yeah, you are on a vegetarian diet at the same time. It didn’t work for me.
Mike Malatesta 02:45
I have a lot of questions about that. But I’ll save those for when I get an expert on that, because I’m wondering where that came from anyway, and many others but go ahead.
Harry Massey 02:55
Well, you can definitely ask me; I’m pretty well read off about. Yeah, okay. Yeah,
Mike Malatesta 02:59
I will, I will have them and many other biochemical approaches. So good news. And as you can see, if you’re watching, he eventually fully recovered after diagnosing or discovering the field of bio energetics, which is the study of energy in living systems. After 10 years of illness, he went on to become a successful entrepreneur, founding a couple of companies and his latest is Energy 4 Life. Is that correct? Energy 4 Life is the newest one, which I want to hear all about. And basically, he’s been all about innovating, to get to the most effective health platforms for practitioners and for people. He’s also gone on in his spare time to make three award-winning films, the Living Matrix, Choice Point, and Supercharged. And Harry’s latest startup, as we mentioned, Energy 4 Life, is preparing to launch its gym wearable, later this year with the mission of restoring humanity’s energy for life. So Harry’s gone from being bed-bound, chronic fatigue, et cetera, to pioneering the field of bio energetics. And there’s got to be a lot that we can learn from his journey. So Harry, I start every show with a simple question, and that is, how did happen for you.
Harry Massey 04:29
thank you for that great introduction. So I’ll start just before it for how it happened. So absolutely love climbing. I’ve climbed like 4000 meter overhanging faces in the French Alps, a free climb without ropes like 100 foot above the ocean with waves crashing into the cliffs below. But when I was 21, these free-climbing trips led to me being bedridden for the next seven years. And I’ll just briefly go through those traits. The first trip I went ice climbing on was in Scotland, ice climbing is much more delicate than rock climbing. Sometimes you come across patches that are extremely brittle, whereby like you teeter off as delicate as you can. I was a few 100 meters up the mountain, placed my ice bit really carefully, the ice shattered. And the next thing I realize is that I’m falling backwards tumbling into the slopes below. Fortunately, I managed to get my ice pick into a really steep snow slow progressing my fall. And although I was in pain that day didn’t seem like anything was broken. So actually, I went home, had a whiskey and actually went climbing again the next day. And it wasn’t for another year when I went for an x-ray from a different accident, another climbing one on a paragliding accident. I was told that I’ve fractured my spine during that fall. But anyway, I hadn’t stopped climbing and before I even found that out, I went to Chamonix in the French Alps, I got halfway up the AGL de MIDI, and started to get this fever, where I’m shaking and shivering. And so I get off the mountain as soon as I can, check into a hotel. And then basically I was like bedridden for 10 days with what they think was glandular fever, just sweat itself out. But it’s really after that I started finding myself becoming increasingly more exhausted. But because I was very, like an extremely driven person, I attempted one more mountaineering trip to Europe, really thinking that the mountain air and exercise would cure me, and I couldn’t have been more wrong, that terrific source to so much, then it ended up being stuck in a tent, eating dried bananas. So I managed to summon the energy to drive myself home. And really, from there, our days were spent on our back staring at the ceiling. And it was really like having a dark cloud just trying to focus enough to remember what was wrong with us. And one doctor told me 80% of people who had chronic fatigue syndrome, basically have it, you know, have it for life. So just take these antidepressants, there’s not much you can do in a car, I was like, Well, fuck that. So I ended up researching and just tried absolutely everything to get my energy back following every protocol to the letter. We mentioned the coffee enemas, which we can talk about later. But also went to Africa to do a water fast, lost third of our bodyweight. And actually, from that I ended up in a in a wheelchair, I was on all of these IVs for about three or so years, IV drip in my vein, supplements, different diets, every form of ozone, all this sort of stuff that basically just trying to get well with just biochemistry for me in that period, was just so completely exhausting. And I actually just got worse, not better. And as I was like laying in my bed, staring at the ceiling, not climbing, not going on dates, you know, like, no such thing as a career that ended up you know, one year, two years, where not even five, it ended up seven whole years that I was trying all these different things. Until finally I thought to thought to myself, if I don’t have energy, why don’t I study where energy comes from. And that led us to bioenergetics, which is the study of energy and living systems. So you know, went on to I think it was Yahoo, so this is 28 years ago or something like that. I went, you know, went to Yahoo, looked up bioenergetics on the web, came across the leading professor in the field, and he hadn’t Well, he was called Peter Fraser who was in Australia. He sent me this paper on quantum biology, I only understood 10% of it. But I was totally fascinated. And it’s also something I hadn’t felt in a long time, which is hope. I ended up volunteering to become a research guinea pig as experimented on daily getting all these all these incredible reactions. Like I would get different boils on my arm, fevers, things like that. And, but little by little ended up getting my energy back and basically slowly started living our life again, going on dates, had our first rock climbing trip for 10 years, you know, reestablishing friendships. But perhaps more importantly, for the podcast, we ended up starting a bioenergetics research and development company that you know that is here today. And today that company that we started with Professor Fraser has done that research and into many different technologies that they see are able to detect and correct your health and energy through looking at and through the interaction of how energy works within the body rather than a biochemistry approach. And really from our point of view for so long. We’ve been using Joe Chemistry. Mostly I’m talking about drugs like I’m a big fan of supplements and healthy, healthy nutrition, but it’s mainly drugs when I’m talking about this to treat symptoms. But you know, unfortunately, pharmaceuticals caused a lot of side effects over time. And they often only treat symptoms, not the root causes to disease. And in the basically, in that process, we discovered how you can restore people’s health in the chemical toxin freeway, with basically without side effects that’s more affordable for everyone. So that’s, that’s how it happened for me.
Mike Malatesta 10:37
Okay, so you, you lay down a lot of stuff there. And I want to dig into some of the things that you mentioned. But before I do, just to give everybody to give everybody sort of an overview of the energy concept of bio energetics. When, when I hear that, and I’m far from an expert on it. But when I hear it, I think to myself the, like, I’ve read and watch these YouTube videos about grounding, where, you know, it’s important that your body be grounded to that the energy of the earth, essentially the electrical energy of the earth, is that a component of bio? energetics? Okay.
Harry Massey 11:20
Yeah, I mean, I could, if you like, I could give you a sort of a definition of some of the
Mike Malatesta 11:24
pros, I think that might be helpful for people to understand. And for me, thank you.
Harry Massey 11:29
Yeah, so I mean, so like the, I mean, bioenergetics is stands for the study of any or studying the energy and living systems. Really, there’s three principles behind it. One is that life is an energy exchange system, to the body is a little bit little bit like a battery. And free that fields actually govern the control system, or if you like, govern the energy that goes on your body and to your grounding example. So in that, in that first sort of principle, when life is an energy exchange system, with breathing in oxygen, we breathe out carbon dioxide, what you were saying is, you know, if you’re walking on the ground, or swimming in the sea, you’re your feet or your body are connected to us, electrons. Sunlight is another form of energy, you know, when Sun, sun goes through your skin into the cell, it’ll, as it hits cellular water or structured water, it will spin out an electron as a as another source of energy. And, yeah, I mean, in short, you know, in short, in short, we’re all interact, we’re all interacting and exchanging energy with our environment, you know, continuously in food and water is only, we’re only two components of, you know, those other things of those other things from light, to us electrons to air. So that’s one principle. And, you know, you want to, like you want to be able to up you want to be able to optimize that exchange of energy, in short, so that so that you can have more energy within you. Or what I would say, we’ll call that you want to recharge your own body’s energy reserves, because the body is a bit like a battery. And, you know, when it comes to disease, wellness, and then, you know, beyond wellness to sort of high, high performance. If you’ve got more energy available in you, then you’re then you’re currently using. So you know, we’re using a certain amount of energy to work to do this podcast, for instance, just to function daily. If we were using like all of that energy up, every day, we don’t have any additional energy to repair and to heal. So you know, we would slightly degrade over time. On the other hand, if you’re exchanging more energy with the environment, and you’re able to top up your body’s reserves, or what I would call a body battery, then then you do continually repair, you can repair, you can repair and regenerate from disease because those results from those resources are there. So part of what we want to do in bioenergetics, is optimize how that body battery’s body battery is working. And really, the ultimate way of doing that is you want to make sure that how you’re using energy in the body is really efficient. Because if everything is efficient, in your body, well, apart from everything working properly, you basically have more energy available because less is being used, and if you’ve got more energy available, and there’s a lot of efficiency in the body, it can very easily repair itself so that that’s really the goal. And that leads us into the third principle, which is the theory that fields govern your energy control system, there’s probably a probably a very new concept for, for people and most people will be familiar-ish, perhaps with a with a chemical control system. So you know, all of our cells have cell receptors for chemicals and different molecules, sort of like a lock and key, and they go into the cell membrane and instruct the cell to do certain things. But actually, all of your cells, they also have receptors for electromagnetic fields. And I from that, basically, I mean, like, light, magnetism and even sound. And that field-based control system, actually is, it’s actually many orders of magnitude more efficient than a than a chemical control system. And so, like, so for example, you know, if you can imagine, if you can imagine, like your thyroid gland, or your adrenal gland, you know, producing fire, oxygen or cortisol, it goes into blood, and it travels down, the blood gets to, you know, the cell receptor and reacts to it. But if you’re in, you know, if you’re in some accident, and your body’s like, reacting instantaneously, it’s not using that chemical-based control system, it’s using a field-based control system, because it’s so much more efficient. And, you know, one isn’t a replacement for the other, you absolutely need both. But you know, unfortunately, really, because of the rise of big, big pharma and just what all the research dollars have, have gone into examining how chemistry works, somebody that that field based, or those field-based mechanisms have largely been ignored. But from a bioenergetics point of view, what we’re, what we’re wanting to do, or what we’re doing is basically use it to make the body’s control system or if you like, its operating system more efficient. So there’s more energy available, so you’re more likely to repair and regenerate from disease or, of course, if you’re well, to not descend into disease, and or you could say the opposite of, you know, take yourself towards higher performance.
Mike Malatesta 17:18
Okay, so, two questions on that first. As you were describing your situation, you use the term Austin hours, often, it was just, you didn’t have a group of people who were suffering the same thing as you was just, this was just your journey. Is that correct?
Harry Massey 17:36
Um, so I mean, we’ve had, we’ve had a practitioner company for 2022 years that’s believed treated like 350,000 people, something like that. So I don’t remember what context I just said us, but no, there’s many of us, yes.
Mike Malatesta 17:52
Okay. But in your own experience at home with your parents and stuff, that was just you wasn’t,
Harry Massey 17:57
that was just me. Sorry. That was different. Yes. And then the
Mike Malatesta 18:01
second thing as you were talking through this, I thought to myself, loss, you know, a lot of people say that’s, that’s the job of sleep, right? Sleep is the thing that, that re charges your battery, right? It repairs your muscles that, you know, get you that’s, you know, with your dream sleep, you know, you get rid of all kinds of things. And what’s that? So I imagine sleep is a component
Harry Massey 18:27
of I mean, it’s one is one, it’s one, I mean, it’s one is one mechanism, for sure. But it’s by far, not the only one. If you had if you had consistent lack of sleep, you know, over a long over a long period, that’s going to make your body’s control system more inefficient. And obviously, you feel that well, we all feel those effects pretty, pretty insane. So if we don’t sleep, we feel very inefficient the next day for sure.
Mike Malatesta 18:56
Okay, okay. So now, if you don’t mind before we go any more forward, I want to I’d like to go back because your climbing was free climbing. Is that what you said? Are a lot of
Harry Massey 19:09
ideas. I did every I did every kind. But the first accident was yeah, it was ice climbing. Well, when I was on the outside was, well, hybrid rock climbing mountaineering.
Mike Malatesta 19:21
Okay. And was that something so? Anytime I talked to somebody like that, I I think about that. Alex Honnold is his name. I think that’s his name, the free climb, or whatever the movie wasn’t. It’s just so scary to watch, as, I don’t know what it’s like to do it. So that’s where I’m going with this question. But it’s so scary to watch people like you and like him do these things because you’re always putting yourself in the shoes of the person but not moving.
Harry Massey 19:55
Very, it’s very practiced. Yeah. At that, at that level. Oh,
Mike Malatesta 20:00
Harry Massey 20:04
You know, I, from my well, from our experience, when we’re first learning climbing the first couple years that that’s, you know, that’s way more dangerous than it is. I know what our age I’m like fully seven than how it is these days, because you’ve just, you’ve done it so much. So like, you know, I know where my risk level is. Alex Honnold knows where his risk level is, if you if you go beyond your ability, then obviously, that’s incredibly dangerous.
Mike Malatesta 20:35
Right. Right. Right. And you mentioned, I think you mentioned that when you, you fell you, you hurt your back, is that there was a there was something serious going on that you can’t you
Harry Massey 20:48
can’t I fractured my spine, but I do. Okay. But I didn’t I didn’t know at the time, I just, I just had a lot of back pain.
Mike Malatesta 20:57
Okay, and like you said, it was just like, Well, I’m just going to climb my way through it. Basically, I’m just going to keep doing this. And because I’ve heard before, and is that the mentality, like I’ve been hurt before I’ve climbed through it, or
Harry Massey 21:09
it was It wasn’t so much about the pain. In that case, it was I was getting, I was getting increasingly exhausted, and tired. But I just thought like, you know, fresh, fresh air, good food, all these things would heal me. With the benefit with the benefit of hindsight, rash, air, jet, gentle walks, good food, that would have been perfect, but I wasn’t doing that. I was mountaineering, which is a whole other level of activity.
Mike Malatesta 21:40
So was it and I don’t know if you even know what it ultimately was, but was do you think it was the combination of the fractured spine plus pushing it? Beyond? Where might as
Harry Massey 21:53
I say is what? Yeah, well, there’s more there was multiple triggers. So what one you know, one for sure. I’ve done some damage to my spine. too. I was very I wasn’t, I wasn’t, I think the real thing is, I didn’t manage my energy at all in those days. I just feel I could push through it. And I had, I had no concept of you know, what we’re talking about here of a of a body battery and being able to manage your energy. You know, for free, I did get a viral illnesses related to you know, people getting chronic fatigue, so that was glandular fever, I’m here, it’s called at some bar should have said that some bar. Okay.
Mike Malatesta 22:36
And when you? Well, first of all, you had to, I would think, when the doctors told you that you were suffering from chronic fatigue, and there was really nothing that you could do, you had to, I mean, obviously, you rejected that notion, but that had to come out of thin air, like somebody who’s as energetic for example, as you and always able to sort of push through to be told that you had chronic fatigue syndrome, was that just way out of the blue for you? Or, or the first time you’re,
Harry Massey 23:08
um, I mean, it’s not. I mean, if it came on, it came on gradually, like over that two years. And, you know, you go from tired to being really tired. You know, extremely, extremely tired to being bedridden our capacity, really, so I mean, that, you know, that was a two, two and a half year, like decline. So, it wasn’t sudden per se. I mean, I knew there was something very wrong with me. By the time I had a diagnosis.
Mike Malatesta 23:41
Okay. And how much did the Epstein Barr or the gland glandular? Sorry, I forget the second word on that.
Harry Massey 23:49
How much glandular fever? Yeah, how
Mike Malatesta 23:51
much did that you know what contribute, I guess you to the decline. Um,
Harry Massey 24:01
so if someone’s energy is really low, you just don’t you just don’t recover. It’s like, if if my heart was managing my energy appropriately, after that glandular fever episode, I would have been, in retrospect, I would have taken it easy for the net for the next couple of months. But as well as I think, yeah, I was at the end of my second year of university. So that was in the summer holiday, and, you know, went into my final year at university with, you know, all the exams and our climbing and everything else that was going on. So I just kept pushing it. But really, if I’d allowed myself to repair like, I’m sure I would have generated a, you know, a normal and the normal immune response, and my immune system would have taken care of it. But when your energy system is too low, it doesn’t and then you know, then a virus later Speed spreading and just creates absolute haywire. You know, once these things are taken over, it’s it just gets much harder to, to reverse back out of it. Gotcha.
Mike Malatesta 25:13
And let’s go back to Gerson therapy, then the plant based organic plant-based diet coffee enemas. What was supposed to
Harry Massey 25:20
get it? You can all see what goes wrong in the bathroom if you don’t get it, right. Yeah,
Mike Malatesta 25:25
I can imagine. Feel free to elaborate.
Harry Massey 25:34
If I really want to, but are you? Okay? Well, Sammy, we’ve a coffee enema in the end, do you know it’s going up the road? It’s going up the wrong way. And it can cause a lot of parents to lysis. So yeah, on the very odd occasion, you might get an explosion make the bar from but I guess I mean, yeah, what do you want to know about that? I mean, it was basically used is in the First World War. As a base in the First World War, they ran out of morphine and painkillers for the soldiers in the trenches. But all they had around was coffee. So they basically gave coffee enemas, and it had a pain reduction effect. So that was the first time coffee enemas were used a lot. And then it was noticed by this doctor called Dr. Max Gerson is a German doctor. And he noticed when he was doing he had he had he has some soldiers who had cancer and their cancer went away. And so he was like, Oh, that’s interesting. So then he basically, I think, so he was in a, in a hospital with a lot of cancer patients. He then tried it on Fifth 50 people with cancer. Can’t remember how many people you managed to reverse it from, but it was it was mostly I do remember it was most of them using coffee enemas. And then he added because, because the coffee enemas will deplete your minerals, nutrition, he wanted to flood them with nutrition. So he would basically provide them like liters of, of juice per day and a vegetarian diet and all of these sorts of things to provide all the enzymes and nutrients and yeah, and he had, he had really good results with that. I think from a you know, from a more modern point of view, like, you know, we’ve had all the vegetarian, paleo, I guess, arguments and debates with all the health experts in the States. But from a, from a, from a more modern point of view, yeah, you, you can actually take the benefits of some occasional coffee enemas, that that will really detoxify your liver and system, but you can, you can still eat meat, paleo, and you know, all that type of stuff as well. And you don’t have to do it to such an extreme, like, they were doing four or five animals a day, which is an awful lot of caffeine to get in your system. So you know, I’m not so much a fan of the extreme pneus of it. And that’s definitely something I’ve learned over time, like, anything to an extreme as is generally not honestly the path like your body, your body works really well to like little signals. And you know, the body will respond to signals, but you don’t need to do things to extremes. Like, you don’t need to be like Wim Hof. And, like the being at ice bath for 20 minutes a day or like, you know, run in the Sahara desert and extreme heat or, you know, I mean, there’s a lot of therapies that you can go very extreme. Yeah, I, I wouldn’t advise that. I’ve done these extreme things like a long time ago. And I’ve, I’m a lot healthier now without doing all the extreme things.
Mike Malatesta 28:56
Well, that’s in the Sahara. I’m looking forward to talking about that. But I will say that I would rather do the cold box than the coffee enema, I think especially repeated i, and it’s just so if I get that in the in the Gerson, it’s basically you’re removing, I’m not sure what the caffeine impact is. So your it seems like things that are supplementing good things.
Harry Massey 29:19
So in your lower colon, there’s hepatic veins that go direct to the liver. So when you take it in that way versus drinking it, you get a very, very strong, quick hit to the liver. And the liver reacts by dumping tons of oil basically. And it also called the glutathione transfer system, but it basically triggers a ton of production of glutathione that goes into the blood and ugly it’s fine. It’s given an IV these days but in a glue, it cleans up the body as well but I mean the most effective thing it does is really detox the liver. Really quick feeling like if you Ever have like, liver pains or you’re hungover or anything like that? It’s it really is the fastest route to like feeling sort of good again. If you’re suffering from liver, like liver toxicity.
Mike Malatesta 30:15
Yeah. Interesting. And I don’t know it was by chance or whatever you get connected with Dr. Frasier. You described yourself as being a guinea pig of his what is it? I think you said Boyles and some other things. So what, what was the nature of the guinea pig ism with your initial experience,
Harry Massey 30:37
you know, Oh God, I didn’t I didn’t even touch that did I, um, so our, our first company is on its NES health.com. So I was basically healed, I’ve got one on my desk. So these are called an infra suit go, which stands spacey and information suitable. And you know, how we were saying that fields govern your energy control system. So we’re pacifically we’re talking about an information field. So you can imprint information in base into mineralized structured water, take that and that that information is giving an instruction to your control system. And so yeah, when I was a guinea pig, that was when he was making all of like, the first sets of you know, like, he made 2000 different versions of these that now commercially are only 72. But I was the guinea pig on 2000. That got down to 72. And like I would get, like for one, you know, one we wanted to correct the, the whole glandular fever viral like I was what we would call what we then called viral soup. So basically, when I took the pharmaceutical, I got a fever for a couple of days, and then the fever went away. And then a lot of that are all of those immune reactions from the unresolved glandular fever started disappearing. It’s not that controversial, but like I had an MMR vaccine when I was a kid. And I took one of one of them to reverse the damage from a MMR vaccine. This boil came out exactly where I’d had it and then and now basically, the scar from the vaccine has gone. Gone was once I had one slight clean out my digest system, I’d get like all this green look under my eyes for a few days and would go but they basically they help. Well, they just helped regenerate your body pretty quickly. But you get these detoxification reactions. Were mostly smoothed a lot of them out because like they were a bit extreme in the early days, but we managed to smooth out most of us sort of the reactions from them.
Mike Malatesta 33:00
And how long did it take you? From the time you met Dr. Fraser and started these experiments on yourself before you started, I feel like you weren’t
Harry Massey 33:14
so I got less I got some. Because I mean, literally that well. The first one I took was actually that glandular fever one because I got a fever. I knew I knew it did something. And that obviously gave me the faith to pursue it for Well, I mean, I’m still doing it 22 years later. So but I’d say, yeah, it was it was around to two years to go from that, like bedridden state to you know, like being able to run a company. And, you know, it is, it is a journey, for sure. Yeah. It’s not like you take something and you’re cured next month. But I was really, I was very, very sick. And, and it’s a much shorter timeframe for for people, you know, for people who are just having a few symptoms or not, not as sick as I was.
Mike Malatesta 34:10
Okay. And so you’re the guinea pig. He’s coming up with all these different formulas, I guess. And you guys end up starting your first company together as a result of this experience. Is that
Harry Massey 34:29
right? Yeah, he was in Australia. I was in England and then we ended up meeting in Los Angeles while we both flew there. And I went back to England, he went back to Australia, and six months later, actually, I wrote to him was funny entrepreneurial story. I was like, Well, you could like die in a tin shed with a mad person whose whole other story but basically he wrote to me one day and said like the person who’s leaving his house got up at four that morning. As the I think the geese were making a noise and chopped all the geese his heads off of a machete. So I was like, Well, you know, you could die of a mad person in the back end of Australia or no move to England and I’ll you know become a millionaire genius so he chose to become a millionaire genius moved to England.
Mike Malatesta 35:21
Okay, nice story. You caught him at exactly the right time.
Harry Massey 35:25
Yeah, exactly. You actually secretly packed all this stuff up about that first and knowing like it was shifting stuff over for months and then just went and just left everything else behind.
Mike Malatesta 35:41
And was that person someone that he was related to or had a relationship with? Or?
Harry Massey 35:49
Yeah, it was a partner.
Mike Malatesta 35:51
Okay. I assume you’ve been a much better partner.
Harry Massey 35:57
Um, yeah, well, I was a business full on. Yeah. They were like,
Mike Malatesta 36:00
oh, their life partners. Okay. Okay. So with the work that you do at any asked, you mentioned 300, and some 1000 people that you’ve impacted. Tell us more about what the work there actually isn’t, is that the work that’s the is Energy 4 Life. And this, this, this new wearable device that you’re creating a byproduct of, of all of that experience?
Harry Massey 36:32
It’s, yeah, it’s related. So in, in our, in our NES world, it’s a, it’s a practitioner channel company. Like we have a few 1000 bioenergetic practitioners and MCs in the States was a bunch in Europe and Australia as well. And that we have this we have this system called a biogenic wellness system, where people can scan the energy of all their different organs and meridians and Mind Body states. And that that basically works out where in your energetic control system that there’s something wrong. And then it rec basically recommends these emphases schools or then trigger a trigger a healing response to get you back in exactly the same way that that I got myself better. And in any energy for life. So pilot, part of our motivation originally, or like, part of the reason this even exists is because, like we were, you know, when we were really sick, I think I was 26 at the time. And you know, I was like, okay, like, how on earth do we get out of this situation? And now I’ve come across bioenergetics, but I was just thinking to myself, well, like how like a How can I get myself better be and how can I generate an income? So because I couldn’t have a normal job, like go into an office for a normal job? And like, see, honestly, how could I escape from escape from living at home with my parents? And so I was like, Well, I’ve got to have some form of business. But wouldn’t it be good if we had a company that could basically help people get get their health back, and obviously, I might get my health back in the same process. And so I wanted to make a home wellness system, and I was thinking something like, an X box type thing that you know, is connected to people’s TVs that would work out how to what actually my words were, like, would provide you the information to get you better again, but meaning, you know, like, technical, he’ll, like written information. I wasn’t thinking and like it ended up actual information and printed that was actually a direct message to your body. And, you know, I don’t know if you’re into the universe, like just bringing people but it was that it was that set of thinking that, you know, that swag got introduced to Peter Fraser, which was, you know, I don’t know a billion in one chances because he’s in Australia, and an older professor and a young sick kid in England. So it’s not a very likely chance of us getting connected, but the universe or life seems to do seems to make the impossible happen when you’re when you’re quite clear about what you want to do. Yeah, I
Mike Malatesta 39:37
always I do believe that. I always think about it as convergence. So it’s not it’s not often an accidental thing. It’s because you’ve, you have something you’re looking for and someone has something that that you’re looking for and because you’re on the search, you know, and you put that message out there that that there’s you know, there comes a Timing you and your paths converge. And because you’re looking for the convergence, you see it. But a lot of times people that aren’t looking for it, they converge and looking forward to they don’t see it right. And they just bypass it just goes right past them.
Harry Massey 40:16
Yeah. So if they like the universe conspires to help people are very, very sure and committed to what they want to do.
Mike Malatesta 40:26
Right. Right. Right. Yeah. So as you were, as you’ve been talking, I was kind of thinking about, you talked about your practitioners, I’d like to know what a practitioner is and does. But my mind went to I think it was Reiki that I went to I’m not sure there was, I was at a resort and they had this thing. And this woman sort of stood over top of me, and sort of had this. She had a couple of tools. And she was basically telling me where I had the right kind of energy in my body and where I had the wrong kind of energy in my body. And I know that what you’re doing is not exactly, probably not anything close to that, but it was it was an interesting experiment, but then at the end of it, I was like, Okay, well, what do I do? You know, you said that I don’t have the right energy, like, say here in my body, right? Like, I don’t know what to do to.
Harry Massey 41:20
Right. I mean it right. And rightly, they they’re they do the treatment, then then in the general, like, you don’t have to do anything like that.
Mike Malatesta 41:31
Maybe it was a different turn. I wish I could she never touched me. She didn’t touch me at all. She just
Harry Massey 41:38
yeah, that was yeah, that would be wrong. Oh, well, there’ll be a pendulum she’s probably the pendulum. Yeah. I mean, the problem with I don’t want to upset all pendulum users. In your view, what do you believe your Yeah, okay. Well, what, I guess, I guess from our experience, like with pendulums, pendulums and muscle testing, like there are, there are some very, there are some very good people who can make that work. But it’s, it’s very easy to influence the pendulum with your own force and to make it do what you want. So I’m less of a fan of that type of stuff.
Mike Malatesta 42:23
Okay. So, an energetic practitioner is what, Harry?
Harry Massey 42:33
So, well pacifically they basically studied detect, and correct energy in the human body basically. And in our, in our case, or how we train people to do it, they they have this they have this system, you put your work, it can be done through voice, but you can also put your hand on a on a device, the system or read or read the energy in all your different organ systems and meridians and the mind body correlations. And then from that, from that the practitioner then makes recommendations for them they see correcting your energetic control system. You Yeah, basically using the MVC tools. Maybe I should talk more on the surgical. So that’s probably such a far out concept. No one will know what I’m talking about.
Mike Malatesta 43:28
Yeah. Yeah. So why don’t that’s a good, that’s a good thing, because you’ve shown us a couple of times, but if someone’s not listening, what, what is it? What to do? How do you? Yeah, tell us, walk us through.
Harry Massey 43:41
So I’m gonna go in reverse and tell some of the really interesting research. First, Enel, explain how it all works. So, so we’ve just been doing a study at the University of San Diego. And they in a in a lab, you can basically take different tissue samples. So like they can take heart tissue, lung tissue, like my muscle tissue, and in this case, they actually were using muscle tissue and they’re using lung tissue. I’ll start with the lung tissue experiment. So they had some lung tissue, they, we then basically fed the meat, the growth mediums that tissue lives on this medium and an infra suitable that would help protect it from damage from Coronavirus, and then we also did it with HIV, but one that will help protect from HIV. They then basically infect the tissue or attempt to infect the tissue with Corona name fits that with like, Dell has five or six different types of Corona that have come out over the last two and a half years and long and short they will be To be able to show that our in surgical can protect not completely, but it’s like a, like 20 25% protection effect from infection. So basically, it reduces the rate of the virus being able to penetrate tissue and you know, start spreading with HIV, it was, it was a 50% Protect additional protection rate. Then they did a whole different experiment with neural stem cells. So we can take neural stem cells in a dish, feed them again, we’re just feeding them a medium that’s basically the inflammation in water in water. And then we saw a 50% increase in neural stem cell growth over the next 10 days. And then we did another experiment. And this was using cells from muscle tissue, and basically inside what site they wanted to see if something that we call a cell driver, if we could protect the mitochondria from environmental damage. So they basically damaging the cell using hydrogen peroxide. And then they saw the saw an 80% protection rate from the in sorry, in comparison to the, to the control. Yeah, when we use the cell drivers. So that’s the, that just so some of the like effects, you can just get in, in in the lab?
Mike Malatesta 46:31
And Harry, is the is the infamous surgical taken orally by a person or is it applied to the yes,
Harry Massey 46:37
yeah, you just see tomorrow, you can put it directly in your mouth or add it to a glass of water. Okay, sorry. Yeah. Yeah, I mean, and all the all the emphasis cool is it’s, so we basically recorded, we recorded the informational blueprint of like, of how different parts of the body or different functions of the body are, when they’re when they’re working optimally. So it’s like having a, it’s like having an optimal blueprint or map of how of how the body’s control system is when it’s working optimally. And when you send that information back to the body, like the body will basically respond and want to want to go back there and or, like, if some of your listeners are familiar to homeopathy, it, it has some similarities. Although in a way, it’s the complete opposite because in, in homeopathy, you give the body a very dilute substance that would cause the symptom. In our case, we’re not, we’re not trying to call, you know, we’re not trying to get the body to react against the symptom. We’re just telling it, how it how it can and should be sort of like a very modern form of homeopathy that’s now got proven out and in the lab.
Mike Malatesta 48:00
Okay. And so how do you just living your life? How do you track and adjust the things that impact your energy? How do you track and adjust those things like on a day-to-day basis? And how is the wearable that you’re making, which I think is called gem? Is that correct?
Harry Massey 48:23
Yeah, the company’s energy Flyff. And that’s a general sense of guided energy management,
Mike Malatesta 48:29
okay? Because I’m a big fan of wearables. And I wear an aura ring, which, you know, tracks your sleep and some other things, but it doesn’t track my attendance tells me what my readiness is. But it doesn’t actually tell me that what my energy level is, I’m sure it’s not anything like what you’re doing. But I’m wondering how you live this every day that so that people understand what it is and what the wearable that you’re making, is going to do and how it’ll be how so
Harry Massey 49:00
that initial like, one of the main reasons of how of sort of why I got sick in the first place, is because I wasn’t I wasn’t managing my energy. And so we want to, we wanted to make something that would help if you like, a younger self, and honestly include including now, so we don’t overdo it. That would basically tell us really where our level of body battery is in a particular moment. And in that in that work, or in that research, really, the most significant thing that burns up people’s energy is actually negative emotions. And so like things like frustration, fear, and anxiety, like all of those will just burn up. You just have a lot of excess fought a lot of excess tension, that if it wasn’t there, As you know, if it was reduced, you would actually have much more energy available because you wouldn’t be using it all up in those in those negative ways. So we basically wanted to make a wearable that could detect correct and protect your emotional energy. And I’ll, I’ll start with how we’re detecting it. So, in Chinese medicine, though, people will, we’ll take a take a pulse, and there’s 29 Different Chinese medicine pulses. We, we saw that before. Well, that’s pretty interesting. And a lot of these pulses have these emotional characteristics. So a wiry pulse is generally related to frustration, or even anger at the extreme. A soggy dash, like spleen pulse, is, is related to anxiety, a, like a heart pulse, which I think is Yeah, I think it’s a knotted inbound pulse is, is related to impatience. And they’re all scales, it’s like impatience to joy or frustration to decisiveness or frustration to sorry, anxiety to face. And so we basically, were sort of basically able to work out algorithms that can read the full shape of your pulse, like versus, you know, you were talking about Aurora, so, Aurora, and whoop, and pretty much every tracker on the market, they’re only able to look at your heart rate, and your heart rate variability, and then they’re combining it with movements. If you move a lot in your sleep and your HRV and heart rate or things, you know, then they that that’s how they’re giving you those scores, but they’re not actually telling you the, the characteristic of your of your pulse in any one moment, pulling it off, like three hours a day, I did mention all that, or they were like, Oh, that’s interesting, but no meetings ever got set up. So actually, I could have licensed the list or years ago, but instead we’re making it. That’s a whole sob story. And anyway, sorry, where were we Yeah, so. So anyway, so so we’re able to basically see where people’s emotions are based on the pulse, but we’re also able, from that, really, to see where your overall energy and vitality is, because in Chinese medicine, there is a what’s called a normal pulse. And the closer your pulse is to this normal pulse, basically, the healthier and more vital you are, so it’s a very direct measurement. And on the correct and protect part. So really, I mean, really, what we are aiming to do or are doing is we want to so someone is in an anxious state, we we want to take them to a place where they actually you know, if you’re anxious, it basically means you don’t have faith, or you’ve got a lot of worry about the future. So we want to help them to have faith in the future or you’re frustrated, well, the way out of frustration is to make a decision. So we want to help them be decisive. So we basically have these meditations that are personalized to your pulse that you can listen to, you know, when that comes up, or at least at some point in that day, when you’ve got some spare time. And, but you don’t of course, always want to keep listening to meditations because you don’t necessarily have tight time to do all that. So the correct part is we basically use on like a Pavlovian conditioned response. So when you’re listening to a meditation that’s helping you become more decisive, it emits a certain signal like through a basic free haptic feedback into the, into the skin and your body’s autonomic nervous system gets used it works or not used to. So it starts to recognize that signal and associates it with you becoming more decisive, so that after you’ve listened to the meditation, like four or five times, you don’t need to listen to the meditation and your subconscious already starts to shift and, you know, just to remind you, oh shit, like, I need to make a decision. I need to be, oh, shit, yes, I should have been like, I know the future tomorrow is going to be fine, that talks gonna, you know, whatever is going to happen, it’ll be fine. I don’t need to be anxious. So it just helps you shift a lot quicker. And it’s based on the very classic Pavlovian conditioned response to the bell ringing when they were just about to feed dogs food and dogs always know it’s going to feed food like this. It’s the same. It’s the same idea so that that’s how that’s working. Now, technically, technically key we could also give these you know, we could we’re saying about these information and physicals we can deliver that via the device as well. I’m not we’re not, we’re not, we’re not going to start with that and make that claim because I, I’ve, I need to go for a few months of clinical trials with the university following say that but the condition response side, yes, we can. That’s okay. I can’t remember when Pavlovian came out. But you know, it’s, it’s, there’s a long history of that research.
Mike Malatesta 55:22
That reminds me a little bit. I used to have this while I still have it. I don’t use it anymore. But it had this device called a halo. Have you ever heard of the Halo? You put it on your head? And it sends electrical?
Harry Massey 55:35
And I’ve heard of it. I never bought one. But I’ve heard
Mike Malatesta 55:39
it sounded. I don’t know, I just drew a connection between what you were describing the electrical, but what Yeah,
Harry Massey 55:49
I mean, there’s gonna be I mean, to me, the future in wearables, it’s going to be it’s going to be combining the, you know, like, or a whoop, etcetera, doing all the analysis. They’re not doing treatments. Obviously, I was it maybe the first or one of the first steps combining, you know, treat treatments with, like with
Mike Malatesta 56:14
the analysis side. So it’s correcting, like you said,
Harry Massey 56:17
I call it detect and correct. Acting Correct? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
Mike Malatesta 56:21
Well, I think so I’m fascinated by the idea. I, I am, this is not available right now. Right? You can sign up,
Harry Massey 56:29
you know, really close on, we’re doing presales are like in 20 days or something from today? Yes. So, and. And those presales will be delivered in two months from today. So we were pretty close. Everything’s there. And it’s working. We’re just in that, you know, final testing, operational setup. But yeah,
Mike Malatesta 56:54
well, so if you’re interested, you go to if you’re interested in this in learning more about bio energetics, if you’re interested in this wearable device, like I am called gem G M, you go to energy for energy for the number four life.com. And you can check it out there and learn about it and order it there. Is that right, Harry?
Harry Massey 57:15
That is? Do you know, you can’t order it today, but in like a get on the list? Like, yes, you can go on the list and you’ll be able to order it. They’re just ecommerce, but
Mike Malatesta 57:26
very cool. So, Harry, this has been a fascinating conversation. Thank you so much for joining me and sharing your story. And I know there’s a lot more that we weren’t able to cover here. And you’ve got some experience with people and users. And maybe even me, it’d be nice to have you back and talk about, like our shared experience with this because I’m really interested in it. I I tell people all the time. taking medicine is it’s necessary sometimes. But as soon as you cannot take medicine, you don’t want to take medicine, right? You just want to Yeah, you definitely don’t want to do that. You’re a perfect example, of course of that with your experience. But Harry, is there anything you want to leave people with that I we didn’t get to or haven’t asked you about?
Harry Massey 58:18
Yeah, I think the only thing I’d say if if people want to see a bioenergetic practitioner and have a scan, then like all our practitioners are listed like there’s a practitioner locator on neshealth.com. But yeah, that we’ll be okay.
Mike Malatesta 58:37
Harry, thank you so much for being on the show. I’ve had a great time getting to know you a little bit and your man you got a lot of good information. So I’m very interested in the work you’re doing and I do appreciate you making time for me today.
Harry Massey 58:52
Thank you. It’s a pleasure during the interview
Mike Malatesta 59:06
Okay, here is the intro for Harry Massey’s episode 321 Today, I’ve got Harry Massey on the podcast and what a story he’s got. We talked about his ice climbing and mountaineering adventures. How a fractured spine and Epstein Barr syndrome led him to explore chronic led him to I’m gonna start again. 321 Today, I’ve got Harry Massey on the podcast and what a story he’s got. We talked about his ice climbing and mountaineering adventures. How a fractured spine and Epstein Barr syndrome led him to experience chronic fatigue syndrome, which led to a seven-year journey to get better, during which he was wheelchair bound for four plus years in his parents’ home and tried everything, including coffee enemas, which we have fun with, before finally finding his cure in a practice called Bio energetics. His newest company Energy 4 Life. That’s energy for the number four life is on the cusp of releasing a wearable device designed to detect, protect and correct your body’s electrical energy. This is great stuff and I know you’re going to enjoy it. And bonus, Harry’s got an intoxicating English accent as well. Enjoy the episode