Jeffrey Gitomer, known as the King of Sales, is an internationally recognized author, professional speaker, and business trainer who focuses on sales, customer loyalty, and personal growth. He has written 15 books that all made it to the #1 on Amazon, including New York Times bestsellers, The Sales Bible, and The Little Gold Book of YES! Attitude. The Little Red Book of Selling, his most popular book, has sold over 5 million copies worldwide and has been translated into 14 languages. It was also included in the book The 100 Best Business Books of All Time by business publishing specialists Jack Covert and Todd Sattersten.
Jeffrey Gitomer is also the co-host of the Sell or Die Podcast. Together with Jennifer Gitomer, they discuss the art and science of selling with the top leaders in sales, business, marketing, and personal development.
The 12.5 Principles of Sales Greatness by Jeffrey Gitomer
For a good reason, the Little Red Book of Selling is Jeffrey’s most famous book. In fact, most business books only teach half of what’s needed to start and run a successful business but don’t teach you the “selling” side of things. Without sales though, you’re bound to fail. Here’s an overview of the 12.5 Principles of Sales Greatness that will help you master the art of selling.
1. Kick Your Own Butt – You have to be self-motivated.
2. Prepare to Win, or Lose to Someone Who Is – Prepare and plan ahead of time; take everything seriously.
3. Personal Branding is Sales; It’s Not Who You Know, It’s Who Knows You – Build your image carefully and excel at what you do.
4. It’s All About Value, It’s All About Relationship, It’s Not About Price – Provide value to your clients and they’ll provide value to you.
5. It’s Not Work, It’s NETwork – You have to work hard at networking.
6. If You Can’t Get In Front of the Real Decision Maker, You Lose – You can only sell to the people who are able to buy.
7. Engage Me and You Can Make Me Convince Myself – People are more aware of their own needs than you are.
8. If You Can Make Them Laugh, You Can Make Them Buy! – Humor is your best tool for relationship building.
9. Use Creativity to Differentiate and Dominate – Don’t be scared to do things differently.
10. Reduce Their Risk, And You’ll Convert Selling To Buying – Don’t be afraid to ask what the risk is; you need to know it to address it.
11. When You Say It About Yourself, It’s Bragging. When Someone Else Says It About You, It’s Proof – Don’t forget how important your reputation is.
12. Antennas Up! Using Your 6th Sense, the Sense of Selling – Be positive and confident; give off good vibes.
12.5 Resign Your Position as General Manager of the Universe – Understand that you’re not responsible for everything but take responsibility for the things which apply to you.
And now here’s Jeffrey Gitomer.
Full transcript below
Video on How the 1 Finger [Middle] Hello Taught Jeffrey Gitomer to Be the King of Sales
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Podcast with Jeffrey Gitomer. How the 1 Finger [Middle] Hello Taught Me to Be the King of Sales.
people, jeffrey, friends, nice, sold, ty, charlotte, business, fax, write, win, shit, thought, podcast, selling, daughter, years, boyd, philly, happy
Mike Malatesta, Jeffrey Gitomer
Mike Malatesta 00:08
Hey everybody, welcome back to the How’d It Happen Podcast. I’m so happy to have you here as I am with every episode and I am fulfilling my promise to you today with another amazing success story. I’ve got Jeffrey Gitomer on the podcast. Jeffrey, thank you so much for being here today.
Jeffrey Gitomer 00:29
It’s a pleasure. I already cashed the check. So
Mike Malatesta 00:32
Oh, good. Yeah, that was yeah, that was that was a requirement that had to had to get the checkout and cash before Jeffrey would show up. But, uh,
Jeffrey Gitomer 00:40
I got paid 100 times more than my last episode.
Mike Malatesta 00:43
Oh, good. Good for you. Yeah. Let’s see. times here. Yeah. So um, let me tell you a little bit about Jeffrey. Because this is a big day for me. I’ve been a fan of Jeffrey’s since the 90s. And followed him, seen him in person, live doing a presentation one time, I think at Summerfest. Back in the early 2000s. And when my friend Noah, Rick and said, Hey, I actually had him on the podcast, Jeffrey, that’s hot. And he’s like, Yeah, I used to. I used to work at Gitomer. And I was like, what? And? Yeah, and then Noah ended up connecting us. So thank you. Thank you. Cool. Okay, so Jeffrey is the king of sales. And he is the person that opened my eyes to real seven, like what real selling is and how to do it. And as most of you know, I started my business from scratch in 1992, and I had no idea how to do a lot of things and selling was definitely one of those things that I had no idea how to do and I was imploring what I call the two P’s principle I was it was it was pity and price that’s how I was trying to get business feel sorry for me give me a chance. And then by the way, I’ll do it for
Jeffrey Gitomer 02:05
free. There’s actually a third P if you want to know about it. Oh yeah.
Mike Malatesta 02:08
What’s third P? Please. Okay, yeah, pity pricing, please, I like that. So, so as I mentioned, I saw I was doing that and then I started getting Geoffrey’s like, he was always he has always been way ahead of the curve. With you know, his his email newsletter video talking about getting testimonials, and really what I loved best about it was, you know, not treating us or his readers as people who were, you know, owed something you’re never owed anything. It was always about doing the hard work and, and really positioning yourself to be a good salesperson. So I I did take it all in and I I don’t know if I ever became a great salesperson, but I certainly am a lot better than I would have been without Jeffrey’s influence. I started reading his column in the machi Business Journal. This is actually a column that I’ve kept from 2003. And this called this place couldn’t survive without me. Not and a good story about Ozzy in there that I may want to I may want to go into work at the Gerber shop. Yeah, so anyway, I’m just he just inspired me and he’s going to inspire you today. So, Jeffrey is an author of many, many, many, many books. 13 books, I think, at least all Amazon bestsellers, including the Little Red Book of Selling the sales Bible. Customer satisfaction is worthless. Customer Loyalty is priceless. He’s got a podcast now called seller die. And he’s got a he’s got a his YouTube channel by Gitomer. You can follow Jeffrey on Twitter. I know he’s very active. Active there. It’s just at Gitomer, g i t o m e. R. And Jeffrey, I start every podcast with the same simple question and that is, how did it happen for you?
Jeffrey Gitomer 04:13
I think the easiest way to explain this mike is that number one, I’m from Philly. My parents were you know, I was raised in South Jersey Atlantic City, Haddonfield Cherry Hill Philadelphia, right. My parents were smart. If you start out in the Northeast, and your parents are smart, you have the best opportunity to win in the world. Because you’re guarded. You’re you’re definitely on notice at all moments of time, you’re challenged. No one gives a shit if deliver die. When they wave at you, they only use one finger And the challenge that you have is not just survival but thriving. And so if you’ve been to 1000 sporting events in Philly, you know, that they boo the home team if they deserve it, you know that they boo Santa Claus, you know, they throw snowballs, you know, they throw batteries, they throw everything, right. And it’s crazy. But if it wasn’t for that upbringing, I couldn’t survive. I sold in New York City for three years banging on doors and making targeted cold calls, not cold calls, targeted cold calls, big difference. And from there, you learn not just how to sell you learn the science of the process. And that becomes something that you can teach at some point in time. And I decided to do that when I pretty much arrived in Charlotte in the 90s. So I’m a product of my environment. I am a college dropout, but it’s from Temple University, which going there doesn’t even count anyway. And I you know, I’m loyal. I’m yesterday, at the Super Bowl. had this habit on nice, because I don’t care. I don’t want those other teams to win. When it when the Cowboys play the Giants, we root for injuries. So it’s it is a a way of life that’s transferable. It’s not mean, it’s matter of fact, it’s not rude. It’s a matter of fact. And if you don’t get that you don’t win. So we live in a condo building here. There’s 84 units in our building. It’s an old cracker factory as the last cracker factory, and when people come to the elevator, I don’t want to run up with them. I hit door close. I tell I was raised, you know, right with somebody hit the door close button. And you pretend like Oh, I’m sorry, hit the wrong button. I didn’t hit the wrong button. I don’t want to I was. So I was way ahead of COVID. way. I was 30 years. It
Mike Malatesta 07:20
was really easy for you at COVID. Yeah, yeah.
Jeffrey Gitomer 07:23
And but I mean, that’s just how the neighborhood was where you grew up, you didn’t really get to know your neighbors until maybe the garage sale when you moved. Right. And so all of those things helped me understand, especially how to get to the point quickly. How to engage somebody and have a good time. When I moved to Charlotte, I go, Oh, wait, everyone’s friendly here. It’s like a whole. It’s like, whoa, they use all their fingers here when they wave at you. And the challenge that you have is acclimating yourself from up there to down here, and being basically friendly. And from there, I developed the saying, All things being equal, people want to do business with their friends, all things being not quite so equal. People still want to do business with their friends, right? And down here, it’s called the good old boys network. But it’s really just a bunch of people that are happy. They want to be here. Well, it turns out that as the story evolved, we were very fortunate we have a condo at the beach, in Wild Dunes, South Carolina, where everyone is happy. Because they want to be at the beach. They want to be there are the explainer Milwaukee where it’s like minus three degrees. But if you live to near the shore, if you were raised in Philly, they refer to it as down the shore. Right? People go to down the shore, but they have the same kind of attitude. As they haven’t they were 15 miles away here where people live at the beach. They want to live there. And everyone goes into the restaurant, everyone who goes into the grocery store. Everyone who goes shopping, they’re happy is kind of cool. And they’re waving and they’re having a good time, because they’re at the beach. So I’ve mean I’ve grown my attitude in the 33 years that I’ve been in the south, and it’s nothing but pay off. You know, I know how to Jersey.
Mike Malatesta 09:33
But I’m happy. Yeah, okay. I had you know, it’s funny that you say about the Northeast. I’m going to ask you about it after I share my my own little story because I too grew up in Philadelphia like you and I moved to Milwaukee in 1990. And it was a very similar experience and I came to Milwaukee. The people here were just so nice. They were is genuine though. Yeah, they were. But for me, I was sort of came from this area where I didn’t get it. It was genuine. Right off the bat. I thought, weird. Am I living in some sort of? Yeah, all Twilight Zone? Yeah, Twilight Zone or something. And then. And then as I started to get used to it, and then I would go home and I’d be like, What the hell’s wrong with these people? Right. Really? Yeah.
Jeffrey Gitomer 10:27
And not only are they pissed off in Philly,
Mike Malatesta 10:30
they mean it. Yeah. Right. They’re legitimately pissed off. Yeah, they have signs.
Jeffrey Gitomer 10:34
And at the Geno Steakhouse, if you don’t speak English, we don’t want your money. Yeah. Seriously? Yeah. And
Mike Malatesta 10:44
if you’re not, if you’re not just off, they want they want to know what’s wrong with you. What you write? And do you think so? You mentioned it was unique to the northeast? And someone who’s been all over like you have I haven’t been all over. But I think to myself, Well, what about like Chicago? Or what about? You know, some other farmers where farmers farmers? Are you say the Northeast is because? Well, it’s very consolidated. Right? You got a lot of people and a lot of different states. Yep. Right there. And okay, so there’s really Yeah. All right.
Jeffrey Gitomer 11:17
You go to New York City, and try to make a sale? Yeah. It’s not like selling anyplace else. Because everyone’s already knows everything. Yeah, everyone has a friend, a goldfish have mother, brother in law, somebody that can get them some cheaper, better, and you have to thrive and you can’t survive in that area. You have to thrive in that area. Otherwise, you’re a failure. Right? Right. Right. So it’s a matter of understanding whole society. And that’s how I got there. I got there by year by year learning what to do, and certainly what not to do by trying and failing by trying and succeeding. And by having the balls to do what you need to succeed, right.
Mike Malatesta 12:09
When you first start selling there in in, in, in New York City, were you selling for your father’s company, Jeffrey? Or was that the.com? No, I
Jeffrey Gitomer 12:18
have my own company I made. I made beanbag chairs, leisure furniture, and that was in the late 60s. Okay. And I didn’t like going in the front door. So I would take the freight elevators. And that would get me the guys in the back always knew exactly who and what office they were in because they delivered the freight. And when I would get I go to somebody’s door banging on the door, I go excuse me, and they’ll go, how’d you get in here? I said, I took the freight elevator like everybody’s everyone takes a facial better. And they were like, alright, alright, come in. You’d be amazed at how many people are doing nothing. Right when someone at the front desk will say he’s in a meeting? Yeah, I mean, I’ve waited for people to get out of meetings, but most of the time, nothing.
Mike Malatesta 13:15
They just keep sitting in their office all alone waiting for you to go.
Jeffrey Gitomer 13:18
Well, they have to do but you know, it’s not like you’re uninterruptible
Mike Malatesta 13:22
Jeffrey Gitomer 13:24
Right. Right. Okay. And I would always find the highest ranking person and work my way down.
Mike Malatesta 13:30
Got it? Makes sense? I mean, there’s
Jeffrey Gitomer 13:32
no sense. There’s no sense talking to someone that can’t say yes to you. Yeah, I saw it even better. The other day somebody put on my I have a 959 Morning Show that I’ve been putting on since March the 16th of 2021. It was supposed to be to easily flatten the curve. If you remember that bullshit. Yeah. Two weeks. Yeah. So that was two years ago. And I’m on every morning at 959. somebody the other day said, why would you take no from a person who can’t say yes. That’s incredible. Right? So just as an example, I went to Chipotle the other day to get something for my daughter for lunch. And they had closed Chipotle because they didn’t have enough staff. And you had an order online. And I’m standing there talking to this person. I say, can I just give you my order? Well, no. I said, Well, can I talk to the manager? And you know what this person said? Well, they’re just gonna tell you the same thing. So Well, thanks for being encouraging. I’ll just go someplace else.
Mike Malatesta 14:41
So you’re you’re at the door. You’re at the you’re at the I’m at the door talking money. Yes, you could
Jeffrey Gitomer 14:49
go away. Unreal, when they’re stupid about it. Stupid how They don’t understand. They tell you what they can’t do not what they can do. That’s stupid. Right?
Mike Malatesta 15:13
That is stupid. Huh? And when you so what was the first thing you ever sold? Let’s get back before you know you had your beanbag chair.
Jeffrey Gitomer 15:22
I was selling stuff pretty early on I I was raising money for a charity in Atlantic City. I sold candy bars door to door I was like seven or eight years old. I gave all the money to charity because I didn’t know you’re supposed to keep some for yourself. When I was in high school, and grade school, literally junior high school I sold firecrackers that my parents brought me back from their trip to Florida. They stopped in Maryland that a fireworks factory and brought back all kinds of stuff that was illegal in New Jersey. And I made money, major money. And you know, my family was upper middle class. So it wasn’t like money was a oh my gosh, I was money. What do I do? I knew it. Because my dad and mom told me what to do. And then when I finally you know started out on my own, I went to college but I not good at it. And I started making beanbags leisure furniture. And I sold them myself and I started. Funny. I have the gift of gab, but I didn’t know how to sell. I just went in blab to people. Then I got involved in an MLM, the late great Glenn Turner, dare to be great. And then there I learned how to sell. Then I opened up a imprinted sportswear factory in in Florida, and sold in Manhattan. Millions of dollars for the stuff because I had balls. And we could compete because we were the best at what we did. And we could private label things because we had things manufactured. And I had two profits and I could eliminate one and outsell anybody else. And and I told the store guy said Don’t take my stuff. But mark up 125% instead of 100%. Now you’re the best buyer in the store. So I had the angles, right? And did it always work? No. But I’ll tell you what, I’m pretty damn close to always. Because we would pre make samples, I would target people. And it was fun. I was having a good time. And I’m in New York, where it’s a lot of fun. People don’t like New York, it’s because they have no idea what to do when they get there. And the first thing I would do is go to the top of the Empire State Building every time.
Mike Malatesta 17:56
Just check it out.
Jeffrey Gitomer 17:58
Yeah, nice. I still have tickets. I always buy tickets in advance, I’m in my wallet. So I never have to stand in line. So I just show my ticket and get in and go to the top and look around go was really cool. And then go back and go to work.
Mike Malatesta 18:14
Sort of re acclimate yourself, like get back there. I totally get
Jeffrey Gitomer 18:17
that I was only going maybe once a month. And the people that live there never went. Right. They’re idiots. Like it’s the coolest view on the planet. Why would you not? Well, you know, people in New York Carver thing problem is they’re stupid. That
Mike Malatesta 18:35
blabbing thing reminded me of something I think that you say all the time, which is like throw a show up and throw up, right? That’s what people show up and throw up. You know, as long as you’ve been doing this, and as many people as you’ve trained and as much information as you’ve put out there. It’s it’s got to amaze you that there are still so many people who are in sales who don’t.
Jeffrey Gitomer 19:01
Well, who aren’t good at it.
Mike Malatesta 19:03
You know, there’s really no reason right?
Jeffrey Gitomer 19:05
But what, yeah, that’s a reason. A reason is they’re not taught properly. The reason is they don’t like what they’re doing. The reason is they don’t believe in what they’re selling. There’s always some valid maybe two valid reasons why they’ve reached a level of mediocrity, okay, they got into it because they feel like though this is where the money is, dude, it’s not where the money is. It’s not no major league baseball player ever got into baseball as a kid because they felt that’s where the money is. They got in it because they love the game, right
Mike Malatesta 19:49
so how do you get more people to love it? I guess that’s that.
Jeffrey Gitomer 19:52
That’s you guys. I tell people who are looking to build a career in sales. Make a list of 10 things that you love. And checking them marking some places you’d work for nothing. And if, if what you’re doing is not in one of the one of those 10 things, then don’t be doing it. Life’s too short.
Mike Malatesta 20:19
Jeffrey Gitomer 20:21
Well, I’m a writer, I wake up in the morning and I write, it’s like, I get to do what I want to do. Look around, I got a great library. I got, you know, I have great friends. I have people that I can bounce ideas off of. I’m okay, I’m happy. And people call me that you least the least, people expect to call your call here. And when they do, you’re like, Wow, this is so cool. You’re blown away, but who just called. And that’s the value of doing the right thing, saying the right thing. Being consistently valuable, being trustworthy. All the things that go along with it, and then all of a sudden you make friends. And they’re good friends, and they last for a long time. Right. One of the things that discouraged me from staying in New York was the fact that there’s very little long term. Everything’s very transactional. I’ll go now and I go to New York House like for fun? Well, I haven’t been in a while because it COVID bullshit, but I don’t know whether you’re aware of it. If you watch the news, we’re in the middle of a pandemic. If you don’t, it’s Monday,
Mike Malatesta 21:37
right? Yeah. Exactly. Elevator to find stuff out more often.
Jeffrey Gitomer 21:41
Exactly. But but the but I’m, I go to Starbucks, and it’s my turn, and the barista. I walk up, I go, Hey, how’s it going? What do you want? They refuse. What do you want? That’s your greeting. What do you want? Not like, Hey, I’m fine. How are you? Not like, Hey, thanks for asking. They don’t care. So it’s not that they’re rude. They’re just matter of fact. And no one gets mad at you, if you get mad at them. Because that’s how their society works. We, I’ve lived in New York City on and off over the years, and my wife. We’re both from New Jersey. She’s North Jersey. I’m from South Jersey. But she was when we met. She was living in Manhattan on 85th Street. And she was real big in BNI, if you know what that is the networking group. And so we decided to live half the time in New York and half the time in Charlotte. And it’s a different life to live in New York City. All the relationships are almost temporary. Because if you said the wrong thing and got one shot, you say the wrong thing or do the wrong thing you’re out in two seconds you’re out. Or they won’t return your call, they’ve got a cheaper price. So I just I couldn’t, I couldn’t deal with it. I’d rather write and have people find me. You know, one of the things that I think puts me in a different category than other people is that I don’t make sales calls. Did I call you or do you call me? I called you. Right? call anybody. I’ve made 2500 corporate customer speeches in the last 25 years, never made a sales call. Never. You put value out people like it, they call you. So I mean, what is if I walk into a CEO of a company, then they want an autographed copy of The Little Red Book of Selling or my brochure?
Mike Malatesta 24:05
Probably the book. Yeah.
Jeffrey Gitomer 24:08
Brochure gets shredded. That’s why companies have shredders, so we can get rid of brochures.
Mike Malatesta 24:14
It’s amazing to me that brochures are still printed. And yet everybody came with that with that handicap. Right? Like I need something. I can’t just go in with me.
Jeffrey Gitomer 24:24
Even your business cards a piece of shit, right? How did you so? Yes.
Mike Malatesta 24:32
How did you get started with writing because you mentioned you know, not school was I
Jeffrey Gitomer 24:36
got sorted into writing when someone wrote something that I believe wasn’t true. And I thought, Well, I’m a better writer than this guy. So I asked the The Charlotte Observer if I could write a column and they said no. Soon as somebody says no to me, I take that as a challenge. So I went to the Business Journal and they said yes. And I wrote every Friday 750 words for 15 years, every Friday until the editor of the paper was an anti Semite, and figured out a way to get rid of me. They lost hundreds if not 1000s of subscribers, I was the only thing salespeople read in the paper.
Mike Malatesta 25:27
I will admit that in the machi Business Journal, yours was the first article I would turn to paper when I was in it, because it’s the one that gave me the most value. Like Dave was like, oh, yeah, like you’re saying, Well, here’s
Jeffrey Gitomer 25:39
the secret, Mike. Yeah, I was in 100 papers. They all did surveys. They all said that my column was the most read thing in the paper. Every one of them. But editorial people thought that news was important. And they were editors to call me up going, What is this shit? Why are you more red than I am? I said, Well, I said, You got this. You got I got two words. If you want to write it down. You’re boring. Oh, boy, I’m boring. Okay.
Mike Malatesta 26:18
And when? So when, when this person wrote this article that you didn’t agree with? Was it a sales related article? Or was it Yeah, it
Jeffrey Gitomer 26:25
was an article about they asked questions one week, and then the next week, they wrote the answers. And they were all bullshit. Okay, total bullshit. And I called the paper up. I said, dude, not only is what your is what you’re writing wrong. But now 1000s of your subscribers have wrong information that they think is right. Yeah. So they came and did an article on me. I phone rang off the hook. And that started the whole process.
Mike Malatesta 26:57
And what’s this? What’s this anti Semite thing about what it? What did? How did why was
Jeffrey Gitomer 27:01
the lady just like Jews? I don’t know. She was a creep. She tried to find fault with everything I did. From the time she took over as publisher. I lasted another couple of three years. While she was there. She was always trying to get rid of me. And finally, one day I did something and can’t remember what it was. But they fired me. Okay, my name ah, at that time, I’m more readers than they do. Right? Because my newsletter had 150,000 circulation and they had 10,000 circulation.
Mike Malatesta 27:37
And how do you squash that itch? How do you scratch that itch? Now do you that 750 Every Friday sort of,
Jeffrey Gitomer 27:44
um, I still write, but I do it a different way. I do voice to text, I capture my ideas on my phone. I’ll convert that into text and then and I use Dragon for Mac or Siri or something to convert anything I have. And I do seminars and all of that requires customized preparation. Okay. And so I’ll write to myself every day. Some idea that I have by voice to text me myself on text. It’s always more than 750 words a week always.
Mike Malatesta 28:23
Well, when you start talking to words, just a lot of times words, right? Yeah. Yeah.
Jeffrey Gitomer 28:28
People This is a secret for your anyone who’s listening so far. writers will always say I got writer’s block. Well, I don’t write I talk. And no one’s ever read talkers block. Like Hi, Mike. Carolee think I have anything to say right now.
Mike Malatesta 28:49
It’s a good workaround. Right that this never never had talkers block. That’s great. I never, ever, ever had Right.
Jeffrey Gitomer 28:56
Right. Why don’t sit down to write and talk true. I, I sit down and then I talk about getting an idea. But right now I have a pretty solid body of work. And I add to it. And I write a book a year. So a book a year that’s like, I don’t know 40,000 words. So that’s you know, that’s half the year to begin with.
Mike Malatesta 29:28
And you do that the same that’s your that you use the voice to text for that and then you have step you then you edit it and or have someone put it all organized.
Jeffrey Gitomer 29:36
I edited them you do. My wife edits it and a couple of our employees edited and then it goes to another okay. I don’t let I don’t let editors change words. I only let them find punctuation.
Mike Malatesta 29:50
No word changes at all. Everything is
Jeffrey Gitomer 29:53
well. I’ve mean occasionally someone will question something but they’re not allowed to change a word. Yeah, Okay, yeah, I’ve sold 5 million books. They added grammar.
Mike Malatesta 30:03
Yeah. Makes sense. Right. So when you when you did you try to get picked up by someone else when you had to be pissed off when this happened? I mean, here you are.
Jeffrey Gitomer 30:15
No, I just felt it was time. i So you did?
Mike Malatesta 30:19
Okay, it’s okay. Yeah, I’m
Jeffrey Gitomer 30:21
Mike Malatesta 30:24
That’s pretty. That’s pretty big of you. Because
Jeffrey Gitomer 30:27
yeah, it was big. But you make a transition. All things happen for a reason. Right? Most people are too pissed off to figure out what the reason is. Yeah. They want the reason to be something else. Well, they want the reason to be not their fault. That’s what I mean. But rather than blame somebody else for the other guy fire. Right now it was time God stepped in and said You’re fired. Go to time to do something else. Okay, fine. So when you
Mike Malatesta 30:59
chose Charlotte, what was the reason? Like you could, you know, go anywhere. What, Why, why Charlotte?
Jeffrey Gitomer 31:05
I got here on accident. I, oh, sold my business in Jersey, a client of mine came up from Raleigh, to offer me part of this business if I would just come down there and be with them. And after about three months, I went into his office one day, and I said, this is a fucking farm town. I have to go now. And he goes, we’ll go to Charlotte. It’s like, more cosmopolitan. I have a couple of contracts. You can use them. i Okay. And literally, the minute I arrived in Charlotte, I knew I was home. No kidding. Urban. Nice, quiet. I mean, people think is, you know, right now, it’s the fifth largest growing city in the country. Yeah. I got lucky and bought a bunch of real estate, right in the proximity of downtown, which they call here uptown. And I’m, I’m fine with where we’re positioned. And, you know, I have a really nice place in the airport is I’m one flight from anything. It’s civilized, you know, fuck us, not a greeting. And it makes it a lot more simple to have a nice life.
Mike Malatesta 32:24
My daughter’s in school at High Point, which is,
Jeffrey Gitomer 32:27
you know, not too far. She’s in a great place. Yeah. She said, It’s not a good place. I’m friends with Anita. Oh, you are? Okay. Yeah. And, um, it’s a great place. Literally.
Mike Malatesta 32:40
It’s one of the Stern School. Yeah, he’s an amazing person. He I had him on the podcast. He, he’s, like, you can’t even imagine what he’s done. Like most, especially as a non academic, in an academic. Lee run,
Jeffrey Gitomer 32:59
right? He’s a businessman and academics. Yes. Go figure.
Mike Malatesta 33:05
Well, you said about you, you know, when someone says no to you, that’s a you know, that’s really well, that’s not yet. Alright. And, and that’s what, that’s what neato is about? Because people say no to, you know, they’ve said no to him all along. And then people start saying yes, and given $10 million here.
Jeffrey Gitomer 33:25
He knows how to get it. And he’s there. Well, in doubt now. The school was making national news. They’re, they’re going after athletics, which is the next thing to do. And a couple of friends of mine who have kids that are Olympic quality athletes are going to go to high point, right?
Mike Malatesta 33:47
Yeah, it’s a great I think I like it more than my daughter likes. It’s just I, I was just amazed from it from the very, very, very first time I saw. Well, sorry to get off on that tangent. But, um, but it’s good that you know, Anita as well, what can I go back to the story that I referenced in the business journal article, where you were working for your father in his cabinet making factory, I guess, and you were 19 I believe, at the time. So this was maybe before you started your own, you know, the beanbag thing and stuff. I’m not correct. Was there So was there this was this idea that Jeffrey was going to come in, you know, the second generation run the business?
Jeffrey Gitomer 34:28
Um, no, I never thought that. I was thought it was this is how I’m going to learn how to do business from my family, and then be on my own. It wasn’t my father never said boy. Sure. I’m glad you’re working here. You know, it was it was a family thing to do. And I was running the factory at 19 years old, from a discussion at the dinner table. Hey, Dad, can I be playing manager because had all these engineers before that it always failed. But I had worked in the shop for years, literally, in summer times and on weekends. And I knew how to work machines. I’m one of the few Jews that can swing a hammer. Okay. And, and he said, Sure. And I said, Well, here’s the deal. I don’t want to start for three months. Because I want to make all the production standards based on what I can do on each of the machines. The chain ripsaw, Morrison, tenor and, you know, routers, T molding machines, paint, assembly, everything based on so I’ve worked with it. Yeah, I worked on I set the standards based on what I could do. Yeah. All right. So if somebody came to me and said, I can’t do this, I’m like, seriously, dude. I suck at this. And I can do it go away. So one day, our best cabinet maker, Ozzie came up to me and said, I need 25 cents raise, which meant 25 cents an hour, which is only 10 bucks a week, but in the 60s with a lot of money. So I go to my dad and I said what do I do pop? He said give it to him, son. Now this is a union shop as well. Just keep that in mind. There’s all kinds of stuff involved. A month later as he comes back and says I need another quarter. This is our best cabinet assembler. I go to my dad. I said what do I do pop? He said firearm song. I said what? He said firearm? i Okay. So when he told us he’s fired, you’re not getting the raise. And all of a sudden three guys from the factory stepped up and said, Hey, that’s I want that job. I’ll take that job. That’s a great job. And we increase production based on firing this guy who was a pain in the ass.
Mike Malatesta 37:20
So instead of what you thought might happen, exactly, you’re afraid of what might happen if he left. Exactly.
Jeffrey Gitomer 37:25
Yeah. So that gave me one of the best lessons of my life. I mean, I’ve had lessons along the way I’m just telling you that that was a pretty good one. Never be afraid to lose your best guy. Someone else will always step up
Mike Malatesta 37:45
and that’s a universal right? That’s not just that’s universal. Right?
Jeffrey Gitomer 37:50
Totally Yeah, your best sales guy your best manager your best whatever. They can all go they can all go
Mike Malatesta 38:01
wild always look at it as you know I I was the you know CEO of my company. Well I can go to you know so. Oh, yeah, no, but if I mean if you can replace the CEO you can pretty much replace anybody that’s pretty simple
Jeffrey Gitomer 38:16
time just a little bit of a pain in the ass to do but of course.
Mike Malatesta 38:21
Which is why so many people that should be gone stay because it’s kind of a it is a pain in the ass. Yeah, rid of somebody because you’re thinking we had a housekeeper
Jeffrey Gitomer 38:29
for seven years. She organized everything new, everything was time for her to go for several reasons. I still don’t know where shit is.
Mike Malatesta 38:45
But you’re still happy with your decision?
Jeffrey Gitomer 38:47
Totally. Yeah, we have better cleaners now.
Mike Malatesta 38:54
So um, you know, you talked about freight elevator and really getting to learn how to sell in that really tough New York City environment. But where did the I know you’re not short on confidence. But where did the confidence come from, for you to start being positioning yourself as the expert and not just in your writing, but in your, you know, at the time you were teaching,
Jeffrey Gitomer 39:14
um, two things. Number one. I looked at my parents as role models, and they were achievers and successful people. And I just believed that I would be the same. I knew I was as smart as my parents. Most kids think they’re smarter than their parents. But I knew I was at least as smart as my parents. And so that gave me the the personal self confidence. And then when I started to write and people started to acknowledge my writing. I went from an expert to an authority literally overnight. And I’ll tell you when it happened. There’s a guy here in Charlotte, who passed away a couple years ago now. It was like my dad here. His name is Ty Boyd, who’s the, you know, radio announcer, National Speakers Association president and his daughter introduced us when I first moved to Charlotte. He was like, the thesis of, of radio and speaking here, right, and he became an unasked for mentor. You don’t ask for a mentor, you just you earn one. And he would call me again, or you get an error. He made me join the National Speakers Association. He introduced me to a ton of people. But I went to one of the seminars early on in my writing, and I wrote two columns on Ty Boyd’s seminar. And then I asked the Business Journal, I said, Hey, Ty Boyd has some papers, the 51 ways of getting closer to your customer. Can I offer that as a freebie at the end of my column, fax in and we’ll fax it back to you. To tell you where the technology was. And they said, Sure. So I put it in the bottom of my column. If you want Thai boys 51 ways to get close to your customer on your letterhead just right towards Thai boys. And I’ll, I’ll fax it, if your fax numbers not on there, put your fax number on there. And we’ll fax it back to you. We call it fax back. And we got 300 faxes the first day, I broke the fax machine at the Business Journal. They almost couldn’t get their paper out on time. Because they had the fax stuff to wherever their paper was being printed. And the faxes weren’t. It was busy, busy, busy busy. We ended up getting for that one article 1000s of fax. So I kept doing it. But I had to the busy girl wouldn’t do it for me anymore. So I had to bring fax machines into my office, I had a full time fax person, and three fax machines. Full time because people read what I wrote. This is really important, down to the last sentence and then took action. So they read the whole thing. Probably seen that. Maybe it’s in that column right there. Maybe there’s the things that free by facts. Sometimes the journals put it into sometimes they didn’t the editors didn’t like me get more stuffs. And they did.
Mike Malatesta 42:48
Yeah, this one has your your one more secret about job success, something to think about and act on everyday go to get a more calm register. And get something free back. So sorry. So this is this probably came after the fact is where you could actually eat.
Jeffrey Gitomer 43:04
Yeah. Correct. Yeah. I think the one secret was don’t be a douchebag not 100% positive, but I posted that.
Mike Malatesta 43:13
Jeffrey Gitomer 43:16
No, it was the one Tigger was lovely. You do
Mike Malatesta 43:19
love what you do. Yeah. Yeah, so a couple things there that are just so funny. So and as you’re talking, I’m thinking about all the ways that you impacted me that I’ve forgotten about so Ty Boyd I went to their excellent and speaking oh cool with his both his daughters and I can’t remember their their name. And I know now that that came from reading something about typhoid in your columns, which made me want to find out more about tai bought Tai Boyd and then you know, you know how it goes, your your your reading list, so I put a couple books behind me Atlas Shrugged, thinking Grow Rich, my How to Win Friends and Influence People has fallen over. But you know, these things that I that I have in my library and in my mind, again, attached to what I learned from you a long time ago. This is a lot of you know, a long time ago, and it’s all stayed with me, then. And then of course, this this article that we were talking about with Ozzy this place can’t survive without me you had all these sort of things in there about when salespeople start to think that they’re the most important person in the room that has stuck with me. And that’s why I asked you the question at the very beginning, I mean, salespeople who’ve been doing it for so long and are and are actually good at selling, but like you’ve mentioned in here, they don’t want to work in the car. Hammer, they don’t want to do this and they don’t want to do that. And then they hang it over your head like, hey, you know, that’s just still so much, at least in my circles.
Jeffrey Gitomer 45:10
Do what they tell you to do or go someplace else. Yeah. That’s what the Mali boy ties daughter still runs the place.
Mike Malatesta 45:21
Okay, Molly. Yes. That’s that. That name is familiar. Then there’s another daughter, right? Yeah, there. Yeah. Okay. But that was so a great course. Yeah, it was so intimidating, because they were very good look. Very good looking. First of all, so you’re kind of like, oh, boy, am I measuring up here. And then they put a camera in your face. And, you know, you start working right away on speaking. It’s like, Oh, my God, this is it’s Yeah, but it was it was one of the best experiences of my life because you everyone improves, right when you try something. It’s when you don’t try something cool. You never, never improve.
Jeffrey Gitomer 46:05
So, make sure I get a copy of this podcast and I send it to Molly.
Mike Malatesta 46:11
Yeah, okay. Yeah, that would be fun. Maybe she remembers me doubt it. But first. What’s um, so now I you know, I watched your you mentioned that 959 You know, show that you do your writing or your text or writing you’re still putting out tons of content? What what, you know, you got a podcast going on? What? What’s lighting you up now? Like, what?
Jeffrey Gitomer 46:40
Children that will need inheritance, probably like that. No, if you love what you do, you’re not working. Right? What am I gonna do stop working and go fishing. Or play golf? I don’t want to do that shit. I want to write I you know, my, my wife Jennifer is will follow in my footsteps. She’s younger than I am. She’ll she’ll click and make it. My daughter’s work here. I get to see him every day. It’s fun. It’s a family business that has family members. How what more can I say grace over that and the Eagles have finally won a Super Bowl. So all I care about. Were you there? No.
Mike Malatesta 47:33
Oh, I was. You were Yeah. Cool.
Jeffrey Gitomer 47:37
You know, people from Dallas. bust my balls and they go, Well, how many Super Bowls of eagles won. You know what I tell them? One?
Mike Malatesta 47:51
Okay, yeah, didn’t you? Yeah, I love it. The Northeast one. The Northeast.
Jeffrey Gitomer 47:54
I watched the Super Bowl. You watch pro wrestling ever watch pro wrestling.
Mike Malatesta 48:00
When I was a kid? I
Jeffrey Gitomer 48:01
did. I don’t watch much of it anymore. Well, one of my best friends in the world is Nikita cola. Who’s the old Russian nightmare. Yeah. And we watch the Super Bowl together. Because he’s a Vikings fan. He the week before he wears pajamas over Vikings shit on it. And they you know, they went down and up in flames. And but we’re together all the time, where we hang. He’s a minister now. So I’m Old Testament. He’s New Testament. Okay. And he was here watching the game with us. And it was just the most amount of fun you could have because he at the time, he was rooting for the Eagles because his team’s already been out. I never stopped rooting for the Eagles even when we’re not in it. Yeah, I didn’t care I’m, I’m kind of glad Stafford won. You know, just want to note. I wanted them to be more of a part of it. But he got hurt in the first quarter. But he did catch a touchdown pass. So not like he’s totally out of it. But it was a nice Cinderella ending for that kid who’s got nothing more to prove. Although they all want to be John Elway and win and win two in a row. So hard.
Mike Malatesta 49:12
So hard. I do agree with you. I felt I felt really good for him. Because you know, he’s paid that dude who’s paid his dues and then some alliances, and he’s good. And he’s a really great quarterback too. And he was yeah, basically, I don’t know if stuck is the right word. But maybe it is he was stuck there for a long time. And he’s,
Jeffrey Gitomer 49:32
you know, he’s a family guy. He’s a good guy. It just shows the other guy.
Mike Malatesta 49:40
Yeah, Burroughs. Yep. Yep. Yeah.
Jeffrey Gitomer 49:43
So though, they’ll be nice rivals and mahomes. There’s a whole new era of quarterbacks coming up as kind of fun to watch.
Mike Malatesta 49:54
Well, as long as we’re on that, I know we’re getting off this but that’s fine. How about what do you think about Rogers?
Jeffrey Gitomer 50:01
I wished he would have won this year. Yeah. Because I think it’s over for him. I think he’ll be almost for a long time. But he has a brain so he’s happy. But I want you know, I want Jalen Hertz to win. One. I want to put a team around them one, let’s play. Yeah, he’s a runner. He’s a Panthers thinker. He’s good. I mean, they got rid of Carson Wentz for him. Right. Think about it.
Mike Malatesta 50:39
Yeah, he’s an interesting story two wins.
Jeffrey Gitomer 50:41
Yeah. So we’ll see what happens. I’m always optimistic. Always. Since I’m a Philly fan. So my, um, I try my best when I go to seminar seminars around the country to play at least a minute of the mummers. Because nobody understands what the numbers are. And it’s so much fun to do. I’ll send a couple links of the ones that I the ones that I watch. Okay, when you’re smiling, when you’re smiling. It’s so good. And there’s a whole one of the one of the bands that fly Eagles fly. It’s It’s classic, classic.
Mike Malatesta 51:23
For those of you don’t know, the mummers are like New Year’s, New Year’s Day equivalent of the the Rose Bowl parade in Philadelphia, right? Which is that? Is that a kind of a comparison sensor?
Jeffrey Gitomer 51:38
Just if you’re watching, say one of the images to members on Google and watch the videos. Yeah. Don’t read the scriptures. Just watch the videos, watch the Stringband videos. They’re unbelievable. They’re literally unbelievable. And they practice in South Philly where they’ve been for 100 years. And they’re half drunk. But they’re having a good time. Yeah, that’s the whole thing. They’re having a good time.
Mike Malatesta 52:07
Yeah, they’re having a great time. They’re having a great time. And it’s great.
Jeffrey Gitomer 52:11
Like, get up at school.
Mike Malatesta 52:13
No worries. So Jeffrey, thank you so much for joining me today. I really, this has been a this has been a gift. I really do appreciate it. And appreciate all the work you’re doing to help anytime and all the content you’re putting out there. So thank you.
Jeffrey Gitomer 52:26
Anytime it’s my pleasure, play goes fly. Cheers. Are you know, they’re saying,
Mike Malatesta 52:34
you know, go get a mentor, get a mentor, get a mentor, get a mentor and you said, you can’t you can’t ask for a mentor. You said it has to be announced. Could you explain what you’re? You’re thinking on that?
Jeffrey Gitomer 52:45
Yes. When I first met Ty Boyd it was at the recommendation of his daughter. We had breakfast at the Marriott in South Park. Everyone was kissing Ty Boyd’s rear end because it’s Mr. Boyd, okay. And there’s an there’s a guy in the corner waiting for you, Mr. Boyd. And so I meet Ty and we start to talk about the speaking business, the, you know, the whole thing about what I’m doing, and he liked me. And I’m, then I became friends with a guy who did a talk show here. And he wanted to do an on customer service. And I said, Well, can I bring Ty Boyd with me? He goes, Yeah, so I call him up. I said, Hey, you want to go on this show? He goes, Yeah. So now I’m,
Mike Malatesta 53:36
you’re helping him? Yeah.
Jeffrey Gitomer 53:39
And, and so it wasn’t like he felt like he owed me but I’d go to his office, we’d sit and talk and he’d show me what he did. He kept a log of every story that he ever told an audience so that if he ever went back there, he’d know what stories he told
Mike Malatesta 53:55
them. Okay. Yeah, so not repeating. I’m
Jeffrey Gitomer 53:58
thinking, I’m never doing that. People can’t remember what they ate for lunch two days ago, let alone what story I told him. So I, I just never did that. But the bottom line is, you know, I’ve been asked to go back to companies, year after year after year, based on he said, he did it therefore I thought, well, chill. They did it. I can do it. And just a good guy, just a solid Family Guy. Once you kids, I’m friends with all of them. You know, we just had one of these relationships where it was a giving and taking relationship. I did a seminar with him. In 1994, we sold the place out and he made money, you know, I gave him money. So it was a reciprocal value for value relationship, but he had way more experience than I did. Right. You have more knowledge, more wisdom than I did. So I did Ask him, you know, he said, pretty interesting. He said, you know, Jeff, he used to travel all over North Carolina, but I was never alone. So what’d he mean? He said, I took Earl with me in the car. So we had cassette tapes from Earl Nightingale. He would listen to all of them. So everyone gets their wisdom from someplace.
Mike Malatesta 55:21
Yeah, there’s no new wisdom, right?
Jeffrey Gitomer 55:24
I got Martin Thai and he was just so gracious all the time. And he introduced me to Charlie tremendous Jones. He introduced me to to Nieto, and he introduced me everyone. But he was proud to introduce me. I never said hey, can you introduce me to Charlie Jones? He goes, Jeffrey, you got to meet Charlie Jones. He’s like you like okay, cool. So he introduced me. He said, You got to go to his place. I said, Okay, I’ll go.
Mike Malatesta 55:56
It sounds like you aimed right off the bat to have a reciprocal sort of relationship as opposed to the, you know, hey, Ty, can I pick your brain? And, you
Jeffrey Gitomer 56:04
know, I, I, people will call me up and say, Can I pick your brain and buy your lunch? I said, Listen, I have $1,000 in our brain picking fee and I’ll buy your lunch.
Mike Malatesta 56:17
I I’m glad you shared all that. I’m glad we went back and got that because that’s I think that’s very important for people because what I like to
Jeffrey Gitomer 56:25
tell you though, people fly to Charlotte. Pay me $1,000 To pick my version.
Mike Malatesta 56:31
Right? As they should. Yeah, that’s what they should be
Jeffrey Gitomer 56:35
now with Zoom can do it over the phone. But you know, you have to be face to face. I think for us seeing each other it’s very helpful, as opposed to just talking on the phone.
Mike Malatesta 56:48
Alright, cool. Jeffrey, Thanks for Thanks for the extra time
Jeffrey Gitomer 56:51
there. By the way. By the way. I’m looking at the background behind you. Yes, right, Boise’s
Mike Malatesta 56:59
Oh, you do. Oh, cool. Yeah. Yeah, it’s it’s I don’t know where the hell I got it similar. Yeah. Yeah, a friend of mine gave it to me with with a pen on it just like it is right now. Yeah. Yeah.
Jeffrey Gitomer 57:15
Mike Malatesta 57:16
That is crazy. That is crazy. Thanks for showing me that. It’s neat. Alright, man, the pleasure. Take care didn’t anything bugs me. Okay. I’ll send you the raw video to you can do with it. What you want was like Aaron Rodgers.
Jeffrey Gitomer 57:29
It’s nice to come in second. Yeah, listen, the Bucs won last year. You’ve had it for 10 years. That’s enough now.
Mike Malatesta 57:39
Yeah, we’re not Yeah, we’re doing all right. Yeah, I will admit that here in Wisconsin. I’m with our sports teams.
Jeffrey Gitomer 57:47
Trying to think of as this guy’s known, bugging the shit out of me because we’re friends. I just can’t. I’m blanking on his name right now. But he’s big Milwaukee Bucks guy. And he took me to my first Packers game. Okay, well, we sat courtside at the whatever arena your shit is. And the because the Bucs were playing the Dallas Mavericks, this is probably half a dozen years ago. Okay. And we go down. We’re there about 10 minutes late. sitting in my seat is Mark You know, I’m talking about the owner of the Mavericks.
Mike Malatesta 58:31
Oh, Mark Cuban. Yeah, he’s sitting. Yeah, I go dude. It’d be great. Yeah.
Jeffrey Gitomer 58:38
Good. You’re my seat. If you go to my Instagram, yeah, we took a selfie. Okay, I put it up. I put it up on my Instagram. It’s so funny. Like, I kicked his ass out of my seat.
Mike Malatesta 58:58
Thanks for sharing that. Anyway.
Jeffrey Gitomer 58:59
My buddies, his name is blank. And he’s selling as a contest board or networking as a contact sport.
Mike Malatesta 59:06
Oh, Joe Sweeney. Yeah, Joe Sweeney. Yeah, yeah. Great guy. Yeah. Great. Great guy. Yeah.
Jeffrey Gitomer 59:15
Give her total give her a
Mike Malatesta 59:21
nice. I’ll shoot him a note and tell him that we.
Jeffrey Gitomer 59:24
Yeah. Tell him that.
Mike Malatesta 59:25
You chatted about him today on the show.
Jeffrey Gitomer 59:27
Yeah, he’s a good guy. He’s a really, really good guy. Great dad. You know, everything about him is good.
Mike Malatesta 59:40
I’ll make sure I share that with him. Please. Yeah. All right, Jeffrey.
Jeffrey Gitomer 59:45
Thank you. All right, Mike, you take care of yourself. You seen my people will call your people. Alright, cheers.
Mike Malatesta 59:52
All right. Yes. Bye bye. Bye.