Krisstina Wise is a Financial Health Coach, Author, Serial Entrepreneur, Runn and Frequent Laugher! She has made it her life’s work to master money. She is a self-made multi-millionaire with the equivalent of at least two PhDs of intense study with some of the business world’s most sage and seasoned mentors. Her training and experience has built proven systems that work– in both good and challenging times.
After nearly losing her life in 2013 and spending almost half a million dollars to recover, her mission is now to inspire others to build extraordinary wealth and optimal health.
Named one of the 100 Most Influential Real Estate Leaders in the country, she has been featured in USA TODAY and recognized by Apple and Evernote for her creative leadership with emerging technologies.
Krisstina is an international speaker and award-winning author of the Amazon bestseller “Falling For Money,” a romance novel for your bank account.
She may wear athletic clothes and a baseball cap for almost any occasion, but don’t let that fool you…Financial sovereignty means the freedom to choose. Krisstina chooses to show up in a baseball cap instead of a Lamborghini, even though she could choose the latter. Learn more about her money school for micro-business owners at http://www.SovereigntyAcademy.com.
You can reach out to Krisstina at firstname.lastname@example.org.
To learn more about Kristtina, please visit:
Websites: https://sovereigntyacademy.com and https://wealthywellthy.life/
Podcast: Wealthy Wellthy Podcast
And now here’s Krisstina Wise.
Full transcript below
Video on How to Let Go Without Giving Up
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Connect with Krisstina Wise on LinkedIn
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Podcast with Krisstina Wise. How to Let Go Without Giving Up.
life, money, business, people, thought, chrisstina, success, question, misfit, big, ultimately, relationships, dollars, writing, create, regret, outcomes, build, remorse, person
Mike Malatesta, Krisstina Wise
Mike Malatesta 00:04
Hey, everybody. Welcome back to the How’d It Happen Podcast. So happy to have you here today. And I’ve got, as I do every week, an amazing success story to share with you. I’ve got Krisstina Wise on the show with me, Krisstina, welcome to the podcast. Hey, thank
you for the invite. So,
Mike Malatesta 00:26
Justin Breen introduced us. You’ve probably heard his name before on the podcast. He’s a super-connector and a really decent person. And so I’m grateful to Justin, thank you, for introducing Krisstina and I. Let me tell you a little bit about why you should be excited about Krisstina. Krisstina is a financial health coach. She’s an author, a serial entrepreneur, a runner, and I love this, a frequent laughter, so I hope we get laughter today. She’s made it her life’s work to master money. She’s a self-made multimillionaire with the equivalent of at least two PhDs of intense study with some of the business world’s most sage and seasoned mentors. Her training and experience have built proven systems that work in both good and, more importantly, in sometimes challenging times. After nearly losing her life in 2013 and spending almost half a million dollars to recover, her mission now is to inspire others to build extraordinary wealth and optimal health. Named one of the 100 most influential real estate leaders in the country, she has been featured in USA Today and recognized by Apple and Evernote for her creative leadership with emerging technologies. She is an international speaker, and award-winning author of the Amazon Best Seller “Falling for Money, a Romance Novel for your Bank Account.” That’s really cool. Yeah, that’s a really cool spin on a book. And fortunately, we got her to wear her baseball cap today, which she showed up without it and I was like, what? What’s that? You know? This is part of who you are. So thank you for putting it on, Krisstina. So, Krisstina, I start every show by asking the guests a simple question. And that is, how did happen for you?
Krisstina Wise 03:10
Well, a lot of grit, hard work, failure, falling on my face 10,000 times and probably standing on the shoulder of a lot of giants to finally be able to see things versus you know, so much trial and error. But that combined with, I think ,just true passion and the desire of wanting to live a good life, make a great life, make money, build business. And I think that despite the highs and the lows, that was the thing that was always present was that fire was burning.
Mike Malatesta 03:44
And from what age Krisstina, when do you remember that fire? Beginning to burn?
Krisstina Wise 03:50
You know, I’m always curious, I’d love that question. Because I’m curious, when I talked to success stories myself, like, was this a new thing, an old thing. And, you know, from when I was young, I was always there just wanting to innovate or find different ways of doing things. If everybody else was going left, I was kind of wanting to go right, and didn’t quite fully relate, I think for the way others were acting or performing. And not that I didn’t go along with things, but I never quite understood it or fit in like, you know, some of like one of my favorite books, the outliers, you know, just always was or the, you know, the Apple were, you know, the misfits. And I’d have to say that since I can remember I’d always thought more like that, like a little bit of an outlier, not 100% fit in a little bit of a misfit. So I’d say you know, from the very beginning and one way or another.
Mike Malatesta 04:40
And is there a time that you remember that was sort of the first time or a time you haven’t forgot that you know, everyone was sort of going left and you decided you were going to go right be a misfit or however you want to describe it.
Krisstina Wise 04:56
You know, I don’t know if there’s like I’m sure There’s plenty of specific examples, but it’s more of just a feeling like really wanting to fit in, but just not quite fitting in, if that makes sense. And, and, you know, I could get along and do all the things, but it just things just didn’t quite make sense or the way certain kind of just status quo was I was like, Well, why is everybody doing it that way? I just, that doesn’t work for me. And just a little bit of a rule Bender, where, you know, that wasn’t that I was after breaking the rules. But it’s like, if that rule was stupid, I just wasn’t going to necessarily comply, I was going to find a way to still reach my outcome. And if it required bending or breaking a rule, I just found myself doing that. So not that I got in a lot of trouble. So I was always a good kid. But I would still break the rules and avoid trouble. Sometimes I get did get into trouble the bottom line, like, it’s just like, just remember from young age, but that’s a general. So from my, you know, from my parents that that was hard for them. So I was like, Nope, I’m going to do it my way. And, you know, it can be simple things like showing up in kindergarten. And you know, my mom wanted me to wear a dress. And I was like, No, I would like my cowboy boots. I’m going to wear my cowboy boots. And she said, we can’t wear cowboy boots in a dress. I’m like, Well, yes, I can somewhere in my cowboy boots. So you know, I went to school with cowboy boots and this little frilly dress and kindergarten, or first grade, whatever it was, but it’s just stuff like that, like I just was. I think cowboy boots are what I’m going to do. So yeah, I just think from a young age just a little bit more stubborn and obstinate without it without being a bad kid, if that makes sense.
Mike Malatesta 06:36
Yeah, it sounds like you weren’t breaking rules just for the sake of breaking rules. You’re you were breaking or bending or wanting to ignore rules that didn’t make sense to you?
Krisstina Wise 06:46
Yes, like, Why do you stop at a stop sign when nobody else is even on the road? I call it a stop signal signs, not the stop signs. You know, just little things. And you know, those are kind of silly examples. But you know, that’s the way I was I thought as a young kid, and you know, I’d have to say that’s, that’s still there today. Now, just hopefully with more foresight, and, you know, a lot of those, that tendency did cause problems for me one way or another, but then it was the solution how to get out of the problem. All right, how about Get, get dig myself out of this one, there’s got to be a way and you know, one way or another, there’d be a creative solution. And, you know, just finding even life in business, I mean, especially business, it’s one problem solved after another, we keep thinking, you know, when we get there, all my business problems will be solved. It’s like, Nope, it’s just the next set of problems, you know, and, and how well we can deal with problems and think through problems and give solutions to problems or, you know, or just sometimes, gotta quit this one, or whatever the case is, but, you know, it’s just, I think a lot of that is just learning to think outside of, you know, what’s obvious.
Mike Malatesta 07:57
And how’s that misfit? Misfit-ishness being sort of universal for you, because the reason I ask is because sometimes people are okay, you know, playing a role that they think they should be playing in a certain environment, were in another environment. I think, you know, they wouldn’t do that, like, at home versus at work, for example, or around certain people versus around other sorts of sorts of people. But,
Krisstina Wise 08:28
I mean, I, I think when I was younger, you know, I didn’t have, you know, obviously, as much wisdom and life experience. And so, but as I’ve gotten older, it’s, you know, again, it’s not about breaking rules, or being a misfit, or, you know, being counter conventional, for the sake of being counter conventional, although I’ve just rendered that way most of my life, but it’s really about producing satisfactory desired outcomes. And so when it’s focused around the outcomes I want to create for my life, and then what’s, what’s kind of the easiest or best, best way for me to create that outcome. So wherever it is, if it’s business or home, but if the same kind of business mechanics don’t work at home that work well in business, I’m not going to have satisfactory outcomes at home. So that means that there’s going to be a different way to behave or perform or create at home to create a nice home environment. And you know, before I didn’t really understand it was about it was ultimately about happy, satisfactory results in all categories of life and then that became like, Why do I go to the gym? Well, because I want to be healthy. You know, why do I do this? Because of that, despite whether I even feel like it or not, it’s, it’s, you know, what’s, what’s gonna get me the results or outcomes I’m after. Like, you’re good, right?
Mike Malatesta 09:51
Yeah. So I’m jumping ahead of where I would normally want to go here. But you since you brought up outcomes, it makes me think to ask you, what are you The outcomes that you’re pursuing right now.
Krisstina Wise 10:05
You know, I mean, I love that question, you know, where I am at this stage of life as well is kind of where I’ve realized it’s what what’s most important to me. And I really think everyone that really is relationships, and this thing even called Love, and the most fulfillment and happiness and satisfaction and, and just depth and meaning is, is just being fully connected in relationships with people I care about. And in some contexts, that’s business, but business is less about transactions and numbers like it used to be. And now it’s more about outcomes of other people’s lives and the impact I want to, to make through my work and through my purpose and in before, you know, so motivated just by, you know, big numbers in my business and saying, Hey, I achieved that, and I achieved this and, and all the accolades, and the awards and accomplishments and the success and the field goods from you know, all that type of feedback. But really, it was more about ego, and it was more about transactions, you know, number of transactions or zeros, whatever you want to call it. That was the motivating factor. But I realized and you know, nearly had to die to wake up and learn that lesson. But there wasn’t a lot of fulfillment at the end of the day, because wherever I got it was, okay, well, success at this level doesn’t feel any different. So kind of happiness or satisfaction must be at the level of next level. So it’s just that perpetual kind of leave, to leave to leave thinking something was going to feel different, and jumping in front of a lot of people to reach certain levels of success, you know, and, and so now, it’s just not about that. Now, the whole, even though the results might look the same, how I feel, and my intentions behind it are radically different. So like I said, it’s, it’s less transactional and zeros based, and more about, you know, how do I feel by helping other people feel better? How do I feel by making impact through my work and my purpose? How do I feel by seeing transformation help happening in others, you know, and so the results again, aren’t about me and hitting certain accomplishments necessarily, it’s about how do I feel by helping others feel better, that still produce a certain level of competent accomplishments, but the results are different on the end? So to answer your question, you know, where I am, as is really in this relationship piece? Like how do I create better relationships? How do I do work that makes other people’s lives better? How do I connect better with my children? How do I how am I better friend, you know, because one that makes other people feel better, and to what I get in return for that. It’s just so much bigger than trying to just go out to the next level of success. With that said, I’m still growing my this business and doing the things and doing all the business, you know, problems, the solutions, and how do we grow? Or how do we do this, or, you know, so that doesn’t change, but the motivation behind it is, is dedicated towards an end result of, you know, I’m gonna love what I do by making other people’s lives better. Okay, I pretty much love who I am, as a result of bringing happiness and joy or some type of Betterment to other people. And that’s both professionally and personally.
Mike Malatesta 13:25
So what does that mean? Look at it, look at look at who I am. What do you mean by that?
Krisstina Wise 13:30
Well, I’d say I kind of couldn’t say the old Krisstina that, that she was so motivated, like I said, by success, achievement, accomplishment awards, you know, having the next you know, metal one way or another. And then today, it’s really what motivates me is getting an email that says, Oh, my gosh, your work changed my life, or, Oh, here’s a referral, or my kids say, Mom, thank you, or, you know, whatever the case is, it’s just, it’s just a different motivation.
Mike Malatesta 14:02
Okay. And can we dig in a little bit about to, to understand a little bit about where that you said, you said, zeros, were a motivating factor where that came from initially. For you. I know. It seems like you’ve transformed yourself away from that, but where did it do you know where it came from?
Krisstina Wise 14:27
I think so. Great. Great questions are really caused me to think I’ve not been asked these types of questions before but you know, one, I think how I was raised and I found I’d be curious, you know, not for you to answer this. Maybe you’ll answer it on my podcast. But you know, be curious, a lot of kind of Uber success stories and I wouldn’t put my level of success with you know, matched up a lot of others. But again, when you’re out the comparison games, you’re not comparing your success to anyone else’s anyway. But what I found is that a lot of people that have had, you know, good amounts of success, a lot of it came out of some pretty difficult upbringing and trauma, and, you know, survival instincts and, you know, coming out of those types of environments, you know, there’s one path that turns out to life, it’s not so good. And another path that tends to turn into kind of this uber success. And so some of that I think the zeros was just so motivated to escape a kind of a bad childhood, maybe in a way and just wanting to escape and get out and the more money I could make, and the better that I could do, the farther I got away from those beginnings, and it’s like, I had to prove myself I needed to, you know, just change things. So it’s that combined with probably an innate desire to just kind of be an over performer anyway, you know, just kind of that was always built in even young age playing sports, and all the things like I just was a performer. And then the third piece is, I think, just kind of the dogma of success and entrepreneurship, like everything, even here now is to go from, you know, go from your startup business to six figures, to seven figures, to eight figures to 10 figures. And it says, though, it’s spoken that to be successful, you’re always adding that net zero. And so I think that’s just part of the cultural kind of entrepreneurship, business dogma, that that’s the be all end all. And I certainly, you know, within that type of narrative or belief, because that’s all I heard, and that’s all I studied. And that’s all I was working to do. And, you know, I even found myself in a situation where following all that say, street advice, business street advice, you know, that that I heard from everywhere, every mastermind, everything was about growth, growth, growth, growth, and I was in perpetual growth. And like I said, no matter where I got, it was never good enough. So more is always better. And that was in every category of my life, which ultimately took me down in every category. But the, the, what I learned is, I’ve been built this business that had lots of zeros. But I was stressed out all the time. And you know, you know, really, I thought I was doing this towards, like, freedom, you know, that’s the thing, we’re all talking about financial freedom or freedom, this or freedom that. And I really saw I had no freedom, my business and me and my employees, my, my everything, I was stressed out all the time, I couldn’t be present at home, my phone never stopped ringing. And It nearly killed me. And I just thought this is no life. Like I did everything that I was kind of told to do. And I wound up with a business I hate and all these, all these problems and stressed out all the time when I’m missing my family, and and all these things. It’s like, what the hell am I doing? You know, and I had to be taken out at both knees to basically wake me up. But you know, now my life is very much different. It truly is about freedom. It’s like how do I design my business that really serves my desire to be free and have my time and to make sure that I have enough space to be happy and to dedicate towards what’s most important to me. So now, you know, businesses designed by in a way that allows me to make a lot of choices, you know,
Mike Malatesta 18:13
and you know, it’s kind of, I’m glad you shared that with us. Because this whole freedom concept, you know that being an entrepreneur is about freedom owning a business is about freedom is you sound like you, you probably have a Strategic Coach connection. But I think that that’s actually really rare. I think a lot of people get into becoming what they call an entrepreneur or a business owner, for not for freedom, so much as it is to get away from something they don’t like. Like they say, well find a problem and solve the problem. And you’re, and some people do that. But I think more people are running away from something they don’t like, or someone who’s mistreated them or whatever. And it’s kind of like I’ll show you. That’s not and that that’s a motivation to get into business. But it’s not a motivation to get to get into business to be free. It’s a motivation to get into business to get back at somebody else to prove somebody else wrong. What do you what do you think about that? Does that resonate?
Krisstina Wise 19:21
Oh, it totally resonates. I mean, I smile, because that was that kind of first half of my life. Like I didn’t know it at the time. In that story of like, you know what to say fu to all those people. Were like, look at me now. Yeah, no, it wasn’t a conscious thought. But subconsciously, I think it was really running the show for you know, a good portion of my professional career.
Mike Malatesta 19:42
Yeah, meet me too. And, and we’re, you know, our stories are no doubt different. But the thing that I compounded that with was anytime I felt threatened, meaning that I felt I was underperforming somebody I was trying to outperform, I would just push the gas down more because I wasn’t willing to accept that. And I wasn’t, I wasn’t willing to give into it. And I also wasn’t willing to, like, buy the help I needed, I had to do it. Myself, because if I didn’t do it myself, I was saying that I was, to me that I was, you know, weak or inadequate or incompetent or incapable or whatever you, you, you want to put whatever adjective you want to use. And that’s, it’s not freedom at all, that thinking is not freedom, at all. No, not in the least,
Krisstina Wise 20:37
not in the least now. I mean, we’re so far from free at that point, like, we’re because we’re still being owned and controlled by something else that’s, you know, narratives or beliefs or stories that are, that are totally, you know, running us yet we think it’s the other way around. And, and, you know, and freedom to is, it really is about feeling satisfied and fulfilled, and this isn’t meaningful life, and I have purpose, and I’m on purpose. And, you know, and I have good relationships, and my kids love me. And, you know, and, you know, that’s where that’s where, you know, the grotto tosses. But we’re still we spend so much time chasing and competing and growing. And next, next next that, that we’re just kind of skipping over, are we satisfied, and that’s that game of more and more and more, it means you’re never satisfied, there’s no satisfaction, in the word more yet, again, kind of this, everything we’re we listened to is all this more is better, more is better, have more, do more, be more, have more, do more, be more, right? And some somewhere, like somewhere there, then there’s happiness, but no, that’s all there, do more, have more, be more, here’s where we get stuck. And we make all sorts of sacrifices and compromises and, and kind of so many times poor life decisions that that causes real havoc in our lives being part of that narrative.
Mike Malatesta 21:55
And it feels like to that, that be more, you know, get more, do more whatever also comes along with an example of someone that they hold up as being someone who’s done more, been more whatever, and it gets to that comparison thing. So it’s not about be more do more, achieve more for you. It’s about do all of that so that you can be more like this person. Wouldn’t that be great, right? And sort of like what you said earlier, you start doing that, and every time you make the next leap. And you’re like, I shouldn’t be that person now. But I’m not Darn. So now I have to make the next leap. I think it’s it’s very dangerous thinking, but it’s the thinking that is so widely out there. Like how many times do you hear people talk about? Well, you’re in Austin, right? And so Austin is becoming sort of this magnet for everyone that’s, you know, successful, including Elon Musk, and some other big, big names, right? And so how many times do you see them being attached to this thing that you were just talking about the me more the growth, growth, growth, be more, do more. And I think that that’s a bet that comparison thing or getting caught up on that it keeps us from doing what we really need to be doing to have a successful life, which is figuring out the future that we want. And then working towards that future without giving without caring at all about what other people want for us, or what we think we should do in order to be someone else? And that kind of thing. I just, I don’t know, does that sit with you?
Krisstina Wise 23:39
Oh, totally. Yeah, it’s just this it’s a comparison game that we measure ourselves compared to what somebody else is doing whoever that other else person is. And it’s the and as a result of that, like it’s perceived failure if we haven’t matched up to whatever we’re comparing ourselves to. So it’s, you know, it’s like, Oh, when I first started, it was like, every entrepreneur doing six figures and now I’m measured up to that now it’s every entrepreneur node set doing seven figures, and you hear the stories all the time of those that make 900 You know, million, but they didn’t hit the billionaire club yet. So they feel like a total failure. And because they want to be part of the billionaire club, and you know, and so it’s, it’s though that there’s a place is gonna stop, but it doesn’t stop because it’s a mentality. It’s a total mindset and mentality, that we’re stuck in somewhere between zero and maybe a billion, and then maybe there’s the 10 billion club, but it’s that it’s that like, you said, that comparison like we want to fit into be a billionaire like that means something to you know, bragging rights or whatever to fit into that club, right? But then it’s also the external validation. It means we’re living our life by what other people’s opinion of us is and how they look at us. So it’s an total outward to inward we only met ourselves based on what other people think, as opposed to lifestyle architecture, which is this is my life. And a lot of times when we’re looking at comparing ourselves to, let’s say, the guru, or whoever that person is, we’re looking at one category of life. It’s like, okay, maybe they’re really successful in business, but how’s their health? How’s their home life? How are the relationships? Do their relationships feel like they are loved by that person? And you know, these different things? And so, if we’re not looking at the whole context of their life, do we want to look at that and say, Hey, how would that person create, take care of all those concerns where he or she has this incredible family life, their spouse adores them, and they’re, they have a good relationship with their children, and well look at their friends, their friends truly feel cared for, and have great things to say. And how is their health while you know, they’re really healthy mentally, physically, emotionally, and spiritually? How is their spiritual practice? You know, they’re really spiritually connected house, their business, you know, their business isn’t a billion, but maybe it’s XYZ. And they’re making plenty of money according to the life that allows them to fund this really integrated whole life, that’s their life. But we’re not designing our lives this way. We’re looking at somebody else’s life and saying, I want that, but without even fully looking at what that life is, as opposed to just one piece of it.
Mike Malatesta 26:19
Yeah. It’s, it’s funny, you said the, you know, their relationships and their family and all that. Obviously, everybody’s different. But it reminded me of a, I was listening to a guy who was talking about a, someone who was dying in like Hollywood, and they had been very successful on the outside. It’s like, super successful and, and the person was saying to them, Hey, you know, you’ve had a great life, you’ve been really successful people love you. And that person interrupted and interrupted him and said, I have all the love that money can buy.
Krisstina Wise 26:59
Wow. That was the person reflecting Oh, wow. Yeah,
Mike Malatesta 27:05
I have all the love that money can buy. Ma’am, that’s no real love. Yeah.
Krisstina Wise 27:12
Well, when I when I when I was, so you know, I had my own near death experience. And it was it was a year of fighting. And, you know, there was so many elements of that just, you know, kind of the illness and not knowing what was wrong for a long time, and it was deteriorated, and just the physical piece, and just how bad I felt, you know, just how horrific it was just on the physical piece of go into that. But on the psychological emotional, what was so dark about that was these feelings of regret. And, you know, to all the listeners, you know, I don’t know, we all have regrets here and there, you know, there’s a lot of things, you know, if I could do over, and I have regrets, and knowing what I know, now, I would have done things differently. For sure, many cases, but it wasn’t that type of thing. This was like, deep regret, I mean, just painful, dark, sad regret, because here because that’s where it became, we hear those things like you’re on your deathbed, you’re gonna not care about that last day row you’re gonna care about you know, and it’s true, you know, we kind of get it like, of course, in a way but I mean, I was so sad, like, so sad, filled with just so much remorse and regret, remorse for the people I hurt, just in my, you know, like, just conquest to achieve and succeed. Not that I was a bad person, but still, like, I just saw all these things that I wasn’t proud of, you know, that like, and so just that remorse of like, damn, Krishna, you heard a lot of people in your success journey and, and so I was left with that, like, I didn’t have a chance to like later on, I cleared all that up. I fortunately, I got a chance to do that. But when I didn’t think I really had the time to do it. I was I left with that, like, Oh my God, that’s not the human that I wanted to be, you know, that’s not what I wanted people to think of me type of thing. You know, they saw my success and high accolades. But a lot of underneath that success was stuff I wasn’t proud of, you know, that, that hurt people that, you know, the public couldn’t necessarily see. So there’s that piece that I was left with. There was the piece of, oh my god, I was just in the success achievement thing. I never like, stopped to just appreciate and be grateful for what I had and my health and my family and just all these elements I was, and I was regretful that I was dying. I hadn’t even really lived yet, because everything was a pursuit of next and war, like at the end of that somewhere, life would show up or happen. And so that regret and remorse was devastating, you know, outside of all the energy to try to fight for my life and do these other things. And, and so that Thank God I had that because it was the wakeup call I wanted I needed, you know, probably called. And I probably had to be taken out that level to wake me up access was so hardheaded and strong and thought I’d kind of had everything figured out, in a way, because my success kind of was proof of that. But it really wasn’t. So just, you know, based on what you’re saying, I totally agree from my own anecdotal experience of it’s the dark night of the soul to be loved in a place where you kind of regret your life in a way.
Mike Malatesta 30:29
So when was it that? When was it or what happened? That made you start thinking about that? I mean, you’re struggling with your health. So you’ve got that fight going on? Is it that fight? Or thinking that that might be over that has you start thinking about this? Because I’m wondering, like, you know, along the way, before you had this, this event? Yeah. Were you conscious of these? You know, you said, I think you said sort of like jumping over people stepping over people, whatever needed to be done. Were you conscious that what you were doing was? Not who you want it to be? Or did you? Are you unconscious of it, because it was just the way it was? And then when you had this opportunity to reflect, for whatever reason, and that’s really what I want to get to is, what was it? You saw things differently?
Krisstina Wise 31:27
Yeah, I was totally not conscious of it. I mean, at the time, I wouldn’t, zero consciousness, and that it’s just kind of laying in bed every day and seeing your life kind of flashed before you, all these things become obvious, because day to day, you’re just in it. And it really like I’m saying, like I did everything I was kind of taught to do, and I did it really well. And part of that pursuit, though, it’s just what happened. And, and but again, it wasn’t designed around was this making me happy was this life of meaning was this new things, it was all about success and achievement. It all costs, you know, it because somehow I just thought that that’s what success was about, you know, with kind of that chip on my shoulder, that hidden chip on my shoulder wanting to prove everybody else wrong. And you know, just all those other things we talked about as well. But it’s all this subconscious kind of beliefs and narratives. That that was running my show. And I was disconnected from from me, you know, if that makes sense.
Mike Malatesta 32:28
Yeah. True. Yeah, definitely makes sense. You. So for me, I call it in, I call that the, this place called the Valley of uncertainty. That’s where entrepreneurs, a lot of entrepreneurs drop into this valley of uncertainty at some point along their path where what they’ve been doing all along, that’s been working, like in your case, jumping over people I mentioned sort of just hitting the gas harder, those things begin not to work anymore, for some reason. And you’re not sure why. And you’re sort of like, this is the only hand I have, these are the only cards I know how to play. And you get into this spot where you just questioning everything. And it’s usually because of an event you know that? You know, in your in your case, your health, in my case, it was my partner being very badly burned and dying a couple of days after at a fire at one of our facilities. And but it was, but it’s there for so many of us. And then the question is, you know, acknowledging, it takes a lot to acknowledge that you just did like that. I did all of these things. And I thought they were the right way I wasn’t trying to be whatever you name you want to put in. But it was just the way I was taught. It was the way I was conditioned. It’s how I thought it was right. And now I’m in this place that I’ve you know, I’ve sort of perfectly designed this world to get me exactly where I am now I hate myself or I hate where I am. I’m frustrated. I’m just lost. And it sounds like that’s what kind of happened to you too.
Krisstina Wise 34:14
But when we go in it without being thoughtful, and conscious and asking some of these little bit philosophical questions like What is the good life? How much does it cost to live it? What is my good life? What does it look like? What am I willing to sacrifice for it? What am I not willing to sacrifice for it? Where Am I satisfied? You know, you’re just asking some of these questions and designing you know, life and a business around those things where money in business is to serve a good life, kind of not the other way around. But it’s really asking the question, what is my good life and how many of us really sit down to think about that and design kind of the path for creating that over time as opposed to just build a big business and, and I can’t tell you now the number of launches. And like I said, it’s common a big costs, relationships, marriages, unhealthy, you know, nonexistent relationships with children or children, maybe that went off on a bad track because of certain things and, and, you know, health like in my situation, you know, fill in the blank. And that’s something that success comes when at a high cost. And number two, like you just said, they wind up in a place like, I created a business I hate. I didn’t like what I’m doing. I don’t like this business. I don’t like anything about it. You know, so I sacrificed all these things in life to create this really great business. It’s really profitable, but it owns me, I don’t like it. And if I could walk away from it tomorrow, I would, but I can’t. And, you know, so we’re gonna wind it somewhere. So do we want to wind up where we want to be and design accordingly? Or do we just want to take a chance that, you know, a big business enough money is going to solve all my future problems, and I’ll worry about it when I get there.
Mike Malatesta 36:06
How did you end up getting better?
Krisstina Wise 36:09
You know, I’m one is a lot of fight. So for me, it was a lot of fight. And then to, that was what I what I learned to going through my journey, and I really call it it was all sorts of journey. But it’s really a spiritual journey at the end of the day that I was. So I just say, again, same thing, but just so persistent and productive and growth oriented and business oriented. Like all the things I was the poster child for, if you do all these things to succeed, you’ll get success, like I would be that poster child, you know, without asking all these other questions we just talked about. So what I learned in this journey, the biggest thing is just I had to control everything, you know, like everything, like you said, you had to do it and control it and and then didn’t compare then go faster. So I can totally resonate with that. It’s but it’s like, is all up to Krisstina in a way. And even that pressure and stress and all the things that come with that. Part of going through my healing journey was just the surrender. I just even I just had to surrender, I had to let go. And it was the hardest thing I’ve probably ever done. But now my life is so surrendered, and I don’t have this need to control it. So to answer your question, who’s kind of equal parts, I’m a fighter, I’m resilient as hell, I’ve got tons of grit, you know, all the stuff that kind of birthed this underlying kind of success characteristics. At the same time, it was just letting go and, and calling in higher power and source and getting really connected to just having a spiritual connection, and letting kind of the magic happen and saying, all right, I’m just versus fighting so hard and going out there to try to find all the solutions and answers which is my nature. I’m just going to sit back and call things in and let things drop in. And so I had a lot of miracles and people and things that came in and were able to just magically diagnose but it was It wasn’t what I’m trying to say is like, yeah, I have all those things in me. But it’s finally letting go of a lot of that and just welcoming in and surrendering and letting my body do these different things. That’s where the healing really started happening, which is so kind of counter intuitive, and, and ironic in a way that, that it was that piece that ultimately let me start getting well, but I had to fully let go, I had fully surrender. I had a fully just say, I’m here I’m going to trust I’m going to have faith. I don’t. There’s so much this I can’t control. And yeah, that’s when you know, the light started turn back on.
Mike Malatesta 38:51
Well, congratulations, by the way, just thank you. And first and foremost, but as you were talking about that I thought to myself, Okay, I can get completely on board with that you have this crisis, right? And the crisis makes you think about survival and it also makes you think about what led me to here you start to think about you know, things that you would do differently if if you had to because that’s the way you start thinking when you’re get to a point where you feel like your survival might be in question or maybe it isn’t question I’ve just I’ve seen people do that before they go through that process and then they get better and they go back as opposed to get better and go forward with this. These revelations or whatever you want to call them. How did you not go back?
Krisstina Wise 39:48
Yeah, you know. For me what it was so like, again, those are patterns like you said it we go back because we’re so deeply patterned and that’s all we know. And so to not go back is has to be very intentional in my opinion. So I sold everything. I mean I first of all force before that I had a moment. And you know, I’m just I’m super spiritually connected now like now it’s almost laughable and like, what do I know? You know, I kind of laugh at myself thinking I knew all these things. And I’m going to move towards something and I let go I do my meditation I call in source I call in some answers. And what just downloads or drops in my head is so far better than Cristina’s. whiteboarding, everything was trying so hard to, to create. So you know, a lot of I just, I get so much humor out of that now, because I catch myself all the time, just and things like that, but part of my kind of letting go, when I finally reached that, I just have to, all I’ve got left is full surrender, and letting go and making that decision. And just, it was just like this feeling of like, oh, my gosh, it feels so good. I just don’t even have to make a decision today. I’m just it, it wasn’t giving up. It’s this difference between giving up and letting go. Like, even though they kind of the same, it’s just a different, because I wasn’t giving up quite the opposite. But I was surrendering to the fighting so hard or trying so hard, maybe it’s the right word. And in part of that, when I finally surrendered, you know, my conversation with a call my higher power Mother, you and I said, you know, Mother, You I’ve thank you for this experience, like thank you for waking me up. Like, I can’t even imagine going back to the life that that I had. And if I give a second chance, I think you’ve given me all this wisdom, like I can see things I couldn’t see before, like you said it was just unconscious subconscious behavior before, just so much about upbringing and kind of the dogma of the way I was taught and be the poster child for that. But once I got in this different space, and now I’m just kind of open up, I’m just like, I got the lessons. If I get another chance, I promise you, I’m going to teach these lessons. I don’t know how I’m going to do it. I don’t even know what these lessons are meant to be. But I think that’s my work. Next is I’m supposed to somehow teach the lessons I’ve learned as a European, the struggle, this existential crisis, if you will, because it went from a health crisis to an existential crisis in every category. Okay, but so I made that promise one, so making that promise, and then I magically, miraculously got a second chance. And so, you know, so that was that connection, point one. And then two, so to kind of keep me from going back, I just sold everything I sold my businesses, I walked away from things, I ended toxic relationships that kind of departed that old toxic life in a way that I didn’t even know it was toxic. And I didn’t know what I was going to do next. But I just said, I’m just gonna live in faith, like, I know, I’m smart, I’m tenacious, and I’ve got all these things, that’s not going to change. So if I can, if I can have a bigger faith overall, and if I can just fully trust myself, like who I kind of think I am, then I’ll figure it out. We’ll figure it out, me and mother, your source. So that was the first step is just I just, it’s like I said, a tour of certifier of my entire previous life and torched it and watched it burns, like, I don’t know if that’s the right decision or not, but I’ve got nothing now other to invent my life new from scratch. And it took a while and kind of funny stories, even the book that you referred to falling for money. You know, I teach money now, but I teach money through these life concepts from philosophy of starting with what is the good life and how much money is enough and, and these different things and we reverse engineer we back into and we design our business life and our money life according to what is a good kind of wealthy, wealthy life, if you will. So with all of that background, and I was very well known in my space, like I was a leader, you know, just my name was a household name and my industry at the time. So it was real estate and real estate technology and, and all those things back then that I torched. So when I came out with that kind of torch and all the things I just sat down to write a blog article. So as a big blogger back then not a big writer never thought I could write a book or never had any intention of writing a book. My story would have been I’m not even capable of writing a book. Okay, so coming out of that I just sat down to write a blog article like, Hey, here’s a few lessons I learned in this last year for that was another thing ego wise, like household name in my industry, gone for a year, nobody was calling anymore. I was replaced so fast, you know, so it’s, you know, so that was a big wake up call to is like, Krisstina, get over yourself, you’re that important for you know, a mosquito second, and then they find a replacement when you no longer kind of serve that part anymore. So you know,
Mike Malatesta 44:57
and you may have realized that the whole time That’s why you kept pushing and pushing. You’ll hear some of the big social media people say even today, like, if I stopped this for six months, then I couldn’t pick it back up, nobody would care, I’d be gone. That’s
Krisstina Wise 45:16
it. It’s a popularity contest until you’re no longer popular, and then this next person that’s, you know, leading the popularity contest, you know, we’re kind of bringing high school into our adulthood. But yeah, so that, so I just sat down and kind of wrote to make the 10 people that still, like, out of hundreds of, you know, 1000s, or whatever, they would follow me on all my stuff and things like, I’m just writing to like to maybe the 10 people out of all those that still might be curious, whatever happened to Krisstina if there’s even 10, so it’s just gonna write down the lessons. And again, Muse came out of me, and I just sat down, equipped, right, quick, kept writing, kept writing, kept writing, and that book came out of me. And that book is kind of my story of this journey. But where money fit into that story, and how important money is like money is more important than anything, but it’s not about the money. And this kind of polarity that I was reconciling at the time. And that’s all of a sudden, 30 days, I never quit writing for 30 days just kept writing, right? And writing in that book, what is what came out. And so I sat, if you’d had a crystal ball before I got sick, and said, you know, as a fortune teller with 100% accuracy, always told the fortune. And that fortune in 2012 would have said, Krisstina, in your future, you’re going to be doing what I’m doing now. I’ve been that is like, the biggest load of crap. Who am I to do that? No way that has nothing to do what I’m doing. I’m on this other track. And, you know, I just, I would have said, I will be your 1% your one-time failure. So I mean, what I do now had, no, I mean, it wasn’t even in you know, it wasn’t even conceived. So when I sat down to write that book, go, I didn’t write it, it just wrote itself, basically. And I just kind of finished it and said, Alright, I don’t know what I’m doing. But I guess this is the next work I’m supposed to do. Again, just having faith in that and like, I didn’t know what to businesses around this. I don’t know what to do. Like, who am I? impostor syndrome, like all the stuff to go through that. But ultimately, that’s what wound me up was just ALRIGHT, letting go. I’m being called to do this. This Muse came out of me. So I’m gonna do my best at doing this, but redesigning my life, so ultimately, I just completely turned my back on my old life and invented a new one. And, you know, here I am.
Mike Malatesta 47:35
So it’s almost like, as you were saying that I thought to myself, Okay, so writing the book was sort of like, writing a business plan for the rest of your life.
Krisstina Wise 47:45
Yeah, but accidentally.
Mike Malatesta 47:48
Yeah. Well, you say accidentally, maybe it wasn’t an accident. Right?
Krisstina Wise 47:52
Right. Yeah. Yeah, I didn’t sit down to say I’m gonna write a business plan of my life. It just all of a sudden, it’s like, alrighty, then I guess this is it. Let’s go.
Mike Malatesta 48:03
You through Your decision, your choices, through your, through your your health issues, and all the other things you talked about. And then through your torque, your choice to sort of burn the boats on that past, you probably created space to finally do that kind of thinking, where there was no space to do that kind of thinking before you because that was that’s thinking that losers Did you know, that’s thinking that people who didn’t have something to do today right now, did you know? Anyway, I don’t want to interject my thoughts.
Krisstina Wise 48:35
No, no, you’re 100%. Right. And you know, when you were saying that, it caused me to think that, that, you know, when we’re really successful and really busy, it was like, truly busy as a result of real success and that kind of busyness, busyness, but there, there isn’t space or time and we don’t, we don’t give our space. Because in the game, the more you’re just becoming more productive with the time that we have really to squeeze more at whatever we’re doing. And part of the biggest discomfort then, and still, you know, it pops up now is having too much whitespace Is that because you’re so used, the nervous system is so used to being stressed one way or another all the time. And when you have all this white space, you feel like a loser. It’s like, oh my god, I’m the biggest loser. I’m not doing anything. I’m not producing anything. I’m not like all the things would be this, you know, this kind of response, a reward that would come out of productivity, and you’d get something back and not just all this time. It’s like, Oh, my God, like people are tired and stuff. Like, I don’t know if I like all this time. But then, you know, so yeah, so having that. But to your point, it’s because I had all that space because I torched my old life and couldn’t go back to it. The magic came out of that whitespace that could have never happened had I not had all the whitespace
Mike Malatesta 50:00
right? Yeah, what’s, what’s on your calendar? Nothing? What am I supposed to do with that?
Krisstina Wise 50:10
Anything so like, you know, in the early parts of, you know, my, my health crisis, all I wanted to do was getting better. So I can go back to my old life. And that went on for a long time, I just wanted to I wanted to, I wanted to put myself right back where I was, because that was a really successful what I thought at the time was a good place to be before I had, you know, my clarity and wisdom. But that was, again, kind of in that journey. If you know if higher power had influence over any of this, that was part of my suffering, I just extended my suffering longer and longer and longer as my wish was like, I just want to get better to get back to my old life when the whole purpose of going through this was to wake me up. But that’s not the life I want. But I was too. You know, I was too in that pattern to think so until finally you know, enough time and enough suffering and then left darkness and enough all this stuff that I’ve already talked about. All these feelings and realizations, like holy shit, it’s like, Alright, I need this to stop. This is too much, you know, but once all that finally kind of reared its ugly head and came to my awareness. And then the surrender happened happened. Like I said, it was after that that was, oh, I don’t want to go back to the old life. Quite the opposite. I want to I don’t want anything to do with that life. But I’d go through so much suffering to wind up to the place where ultimately I supposed to get to, you know,
Mike Malatesta 51:29
yeah, you had to suffer long enough that you got past that I want to go back. That’s why I’d asked you that question. How did you not go back? How did you keep from going back? Because so many people don’t go through long enough. And they end up going back? Because
Krisstina Wise 51:42
that was the answer that just yeah, just realize that my son is just because my suffering was so long, it had been shorter than been a month until I back in or two months, or three months, or six months or nine months. Probably, you know,
Mike Malatesta 51:55
you mentioned in there. I just wanted to dig in a little bit on this. You said Money is the most important thing, but it’s not about the money. I may not have that. Exactly right. But you said something like that, what does that mean?
Krisstina Wise 52:08
Yeah, so I love when you said the quote before is like I had all the love that money can buy, you know, like, yeah, you know, like that causes children humps, and I can relate to that, too. But money is more important than anything, because in my case, it was life or death. Because I was good with money because I had assets because I had surplus because I had a business that paid me some royalties and different things that I was able to write really big checks like in the bio was happening, ultimately, it ended up in millions of dollars to you know, is that just like within a few months, but to get better with millions of dollars and kind of not completely but a lot of truth in like the quote, quotes, we’ve heard, like, I used my health to build my wealth, and I had to use all my wealth to get my health back. And, you know, so but the point is that because I was smart with money outside of my business, building assets, and cash and liquidity, and you know, all these things, I was able to cash in a lot to buy the best health to ultimately save my life, that had I not had those financial resources, I, I would not be here today. I mean, that’s just that’s just like a hard, cold truth. And, or just never been able to recover whatever the case is. So that was a big realization, like, everything I’d studied about money. And the way that I’d studied it personally paid off, saved my life. On the other hand, when I was going through this and I kid you not through all of this, I’ve worked so hard for all of that money, the start evaporating pretty quickly, you know, as I was cashing it in to try to buy the next thing to save my life and buy the next thing saved my life. But ultimately, the money was there, so I was able to use that. But I I want to say it was that my whole life that was another one of these awareness. My whole life was more money, more money, more money, just for the sake of more money really, and all the things that come with that. But in little admits because it at that point, it meant something it meant status, it the symbol, the status, the the being in the different clubs, so to speak, based on how much money you make, and being able to feel good about myself that I made it into this club, you know, metaphorically speaking, and that became that whole thing like what I could buy and all this stuff, you know, all the all the consumption and all the stuff that match like, look at me, this is the life that I make so much money, look at all this stuff that shows how much money I have, you know? And then, again, going through this journey, I didn’t give one iota about the money. I mean, I It’s even hard to believe it. But I could, I didn’t care one thing about the money at all, I didn’t care one iota about all the stuff that I had at all, it meant zero. Like all that stuff that seemed to be so important before, had zero importance. In fact, quite the opposite was in that remorse and regret, because of all the other stuff in this life stuff I missed in pursuit of all that stuff. So it was just this very interesting experience where I was having all the money, the only meaning the money had mattered without any emotional connection whatsoever. So I was able to write the next check to try to find the next solution. But other than that, nothing. And so it’s really going through that, that I realized, like money is more important than anything, but not for what we think it is. Because it can underwrite the cost of a good life or saving your life, if you need it, we’re creating certain experiences and memories with people you care about, or, you know, creating an environment that’s healthy and safe and fulfilling. And, you know, and you know, but where the money serves us versus us serving the money and the success and all these things, it’s kind of on the flip flop. So that was just saying like money is more important than anything, but it’s not about the money, the way we think it’s about the money. It’s a whole different relationship that ultimately came out of the messaging that I wanted to try to convey through, you know, through my work today.
Mike Malatesta 56:22
Okay, thank you for sharing that, I was really listening hard because I money to me is about options. And it pays to have money, make money and save money, because you never know when you’re going to need to activate some options. Your case, you know, is extreme, maybe, but it could be any options, you know, like, even not wanting to work for a little while, because you want to be thinking about where the work you actually want to do while if you don’t have any savings, you are likely not going to be able to make that choice would certainly not make it in a healthy way. You’d be you’d be you know, in in, you’d be scared making the decision. And you don’t want to be scared when you’re making a decision like that.
Krisstina Wise 57:17
Yeah, and it is definitely options, it’s nice if you can have a sabbatical fund like, hey, I want to take a six-month sabbatical to figure out the next thing. I love the word sabbatical. And in building in sabbatical, write a book or sabbaticals to, you know, just think what’s next, whatever that is, but having kind of that, that money, money is time. In that case. So money equals time that having that money that’s available there that pays the bills, it allows you to take the sabbatical, somebody can have these different purposes. And that case, money is time for maybe a sabbatical or however you want to use that time. And to me, it’s like to think when we’re doing lifestyle architecture that I like to call it, when we’re looking at if you ants ask the question, how much? I mean, what is the good life to Mike? And to really spend time thinking about that and sketch it out? Like, you know, what is the good life today? And what’s kind of what’s the good life good life? Like if there’s, if I haven’t quite fully created it yet? You know, where am I today? And where do I want to be? And that without a lot of compromise, like this is kind of it. And then ultimately, bridge the gap is what we do, let’s say on a day-to-day basis, but it’s like, what is it good life? In all these different like categories? Like what is the good life when it comes to wellness? And all these different pieces of wellness? What is it good life when it comes to my relationships? And what relationships are most important that, that I want to really hold sacred and keep strong? And keep you know, intact? And, and what is it? What is it good life when it comes to my business? And, and that type of thing? What is the good life when and all these different things just to really spend time and, and sketch it out? But to really think about it? And then the next question is just how much does it cost to live it? So then it’s like, philosophical, well, that’s kind of what philosophy is kind of answers the question, what is the good life? And then practical or quantifiable? It’s like, okay, how much does it cost to live it? So if it’s a million dollars a year and it’s everything that in I mean, a good life means completely satisfactory? Like, if life look just like this, I’m fulfilled, I’m happy if I blow it out. 10x from that, great, if I don’t, I’m fully satisfied and happy. If I could live this day, every day. Of course, life happens. And you know, there’s always something but you know, in the grand scheme of things, this is a good life. So we start there, and now we say how much does it cost to live it? Then there’s living it today. And just could be 100,000 a year, a million a year just to pick your you’ve done the math, somebody I was like, okay, it cost me a million dollars a year to live my, my good life completely satisfactory. If I never made another dollar more than this, then I’m totally satisfied, put do your number, then we can go back to the business and say, All right, the business needs to profit a million dollars here. So now my business strategy isn’t it doesn’t have to be billion in this case, if that’s what everybody else is talking about your business is based on your profit margin, you know, let’s just say it’s a $3 million business to get a million-dollar profit. Now your whole business model can be a $3 million dollar business, you don’t have to do 10, or 20, or 50. And all the problems and sacrifices and tradeoffs that come with that, because it’s always a trade off your numbers 3 million to get a million to do the lifestyle cost of a billion. But it might be higher than that, because then we’re always working today in the money piece, or work in cells today are working for two selves. We’re working for our current self and our current lifestyle, let’s say that cost a million dollars here. But ultimately, it’s some future age, we don’t want to have to work at all, or is harder to use your words the choice to work. So that’s kind of financial independence, meaning we’re independent financially, that any work that we do is fully by choice, not because I have to make the money in my business to pay any bills. So every dollar we’re making today is to pay for a life today that hopefully it’s a good life, and to build out our future self like for tomorrow. And that’s whatever net worth that so if it’s a million dollars a year, then you’re going to have to build a net worth or portfolio that’s going to throw off a million dollars a year that will replace your working income so that if you can’t sell your business or don’t want to sell your business or just want to torch and we walk away from it, your assets now become your business that provides the million dollars here. So but again, but now we can reverse engineer and this is all very simple math just know how much money is enough? How much money do I need to make today? And how much do I need to put away for tomorrow? All and you know, and I only need to grow to hit these certain numbers and do I five years, 10 years or 20 years, what game on my end is going to tell me how much time I have to build that portfolio to hit my good life number. But now we have complete clarity with our money and our numbers. But we’re working with purpose. We know we’re working towards a good life to fill in these gaps that we have some network gap and maybe some income gaps. But it’s all designed around then spending the money to live a good life includes our philanthropy dot just for more. And now we have it Yeah, not just to have it and it’s like this is full. And if you blow it out great, give the rest away. By the way, if you want it to or change, you know, grow your lifestyle, but it’s not about more is better. It’s about No, I’m completely satisfied here. And you find even in this game for most of us, once we change it, you’re so much happier with far less than you ever thought you would need. So that lifestyle number that you thought you were even after you realize it doesn’t even have to be as high meaning it doesn’t come at such a cost. Because there’s always tradeoffs. And so it’s in this asking the question, What am I willing to trade and sacrifice for these numbers? And what am I not? Am I willing to sacrifice my marriage and my relationship with my kids for this? If the answer’s no, well, could I do it this that wouldn’t jeopardize that. But these are like I call it adulting these are really adult life questions, that if we pre think these we can maybe be more likely to avoid the trap that we’ve been talking about, as well as winding up with a life that you don’t want in a business that you hate. Yeah, that might throw out lots of money,
Mike Malatesta 1:03:38
lifestyle architecture, who are the kind of people that you’d like to work with, as we wrap up here, Krisstina?
Krisstina Wise 1:03:44
Yeah, just entrepreneurs, because we do have, you know, because we’re, I think as, as natural entrepreneurs, we’re wired a little bit differently. And we do have these desires to, to do the things we’re talking about, we just don’t have any guide for what it is we really want to create. And we’re innovators, and we’re creators, and, and we’re risk takers. And you know, and we want to make the world a better place. So all these things, but it’s like, we want to make sure we’re taking care of our own life and be in good people while we’re building these great businesses that ultimately help other people be better too.
Mike Malatesta 1:04:18
Yeah, because we’re not doing that we’re not helping other people be better, right? Well, this has been so much fun, Krisstina. Thank you. Thank you for coming on sharing your stories. Thank you for allowing me to sort of dig in on a couple of things as well. I very impressed by you. And I learned a lot and and just appreciate the opportunity to share
Krisstina Wise 1:04:41
my pleasure. You’re a great interviewer you pulled stuff out of me that I’d never talked about or remembering really, you know, thought about publicly so thank you. I really enjoyed it.
Mike Malatesta 1:04:49
Oh, my pleasure. glad it worked.
Krisstina Wise 1:04:52